The Future Automotive Thread

[zombiewolf513]

Originally Posted by simmode1

Anyone interested in a RWD 2 door 4 seater than runs for over 14 hours or 620+ miles straight on only salt water?

Came across this on FB. It's called the Quantino. ~138hp apparently.


EDIT: Holy shit the red one is supposed to have the approximation of 1075hp...

It doesnt run on salt water, but I would definitely be interested in this if it were to take off. Im a tech geek. I like the idea of the electric system being powered by positive and negatively charged fluids. Pretty sweet.

[kashira kureijii]

Originally Posted by Frank_Jaeger

It's you people and your fat car acceptance that have led the auto industry to where it is now..

For reals, the whole safety standards argument is bullshit too, 2016 4 door rollas weigh in at 2800 lbs, so its definitely possible to make modern cars that weigh that much. New miatas are what, like 2400ibs? Toyota SF-R (which probably isnt gonna be in our market) will weigh 2100lbs

I keep hearing that whole safety argument from people who are enthusiastic about muscle cars, and it doesn't make sense. If there is so much Safety rule opposition, how can Honda and Toyota make 2700 lb and 2800 lb economy sedans, and still get a five star safety rating.

Y'all have lost your way man.

[kingkilburn]

If added weight gives near race car levels of rigidity then I'm more or less OK with it. Ideally we start seeing aluminum used on the scale of the nsx with some carbon fiber thrown in, but were talking about reasonably affordable cars here for the most part.

[exitspeed]

Originally Posted by Dutchmalmiss

Would you say weights of these cars have hit a ceiling now? Tech is getting lighter/smaller/cheaper nowadays. I guess we are still waiting on lighterweight steel and aluminum to become cheaper for mass-production?

I never thought that at this time I'd be saying "can't wait to see the new mustang/focus/camaro!" instead of "can't wait for the new silvia/240!" Man times have changed haha.

The peak was definitely hit a few years ago. Sure some cars are still going to get bigger and heavier, but everyone is forced to make more fuel efficient cars (the cafe regulation for a fleet is like 35mpg which the auto manufacturers lost their minds over when Obama announced that). Engine technology is moving towards turbo charging and other methods but adding lightness is just as big of a priority. Here's just no way to keep adding sensors and safety tech without adding weight, so engineering a lighter car is pretty much a must.

[zerodameaon]

Originally Posted by Frank_Jaeger

It's you people and your fat car acceptance that have led the auto industry to where it is now.

Get off your high horse, I did not accept shit. Curb weight of a 94 mustang, around 3400lbs with 215hp, a 2016 mustang with 435hp comes in at 3700-3800 depending on features.


I am not going to run out to buy a Miata to get a light ass car, they also are bloated as shit, first gen Mitatas came in at 2000lbs, new ones are ~2400, so about the same bloat as a new mustang. I have a old "light car" and its got a weak motor and is still almost as heavy as my new car. Sure I will have a lot less issues ripping weight out of the S13 though.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by kashira kureijii

For reals, the whole safety standards argument is bullshit too, 2016 4 door rollas weigh in at 2800 lbs, so its definitely possible to make modern cars that weigh that much. New miatas are what, like 2400ibs? Toyota SF-R (which probably isnt gonna be in our market) will weigh 2100lbs



I keep hearing that whole safety argument from people who are enthusiastic about muscle cars, and it doesn't make sense. If there is so much Safety rule opposition, how can Honda and Toyota make 2700 lb and 2800 lb economy sedans, and still get a five star safety rating.



Y'all have lost your way man.

Why is it so hard to peel apples? Bananas are super easy to peel!!


Corollas and Civics are astronomically heavier then their predecessors.

An economy car is designed for minimum amount of comfort and safety. A M4 or Mustang is still going to be safer, better built a Ms larger then a Honda Fit.

The original Miata weighted 2100lbs, the new one is 2,400lbs. Yes, it's 1,000lbs lighter then a Mustang, but it still got heavier. In other news an Aircraft Carrier is heavier then a Dump Truck.


Part of the reason performance cars are heavier is because performance parts are heavier.

The venerable T56 weights 110lbs compared to the weaker T45's 70lbs. The T56's upgraded replacement, the TR6060 weights 130lbs.

Modern muscle cars are now pushing 15.5" Rotors and 6-pot calipers, compared to 10-11" rotors and single piston brakes from the 90's.

Wheels are 18-20" instead of 14-16".

Interiors are plush and spacious, instead of cramped and tinny.

Chassis strength is out of this damn world. Any of these cars are going to be stiffer then a caged 240sx.

Bigger engines, bigger cooling systems, better HVAC systems, bigger wheels, brakes, seats...

Add 20#, 15# here and 19# there and yeah, cars gained ~ 500lbs over the last 20 years.


Camaro is currently lighter then the Mustang because it shrank, has Alumium suspension arms and a Swiss Cheese rear subframe. It also costs $5k more.

If you modified a S550, I suspect you could pull 300lbs out of it without making it a hoonibro race car.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by Frank_Jaeger

Power to weight is a great indicator of acceleration characteristics but we're talking about the big picture here. Adding power to a car does not make it weigh less, it's not the same thing. I would rather have a 250hp 2500lbs car (like my 240) than a 350hp 3500lbs car (like my Z28 Camaro).

That's idiotic.

We're not talking about some bullshit 4th Gen Mullet Mobile here, nor a wet noodle Weeboo whip.

I strongly suspect a stockish 240sx (with stock-ish SR) will get decimated by a Ecoboost Mustang on any open track.

Braking, suspension design, power delivery and chassis rigidity have all greatly improved in the last 30 years.

Just look at the Blood Magic performed by the +4,000lb GTR.

[Matej]

You guys and your transmissions and brakes and dinosaur combustion engines. Get with regenerative braking and direct-drive already.


This is the only conventional car that I would consider. Manual readily available in all models including diesels, RWD-only, turbos, aluminum-steel chassis, carbon fiber driveshaft, 50:50 weight distribution, quick-ratio steering, and most importantly, it looks good.

A nice bonus is that you can also see out of it.

[Matej]

Originally Posted by Corbic

If you modified a S550, I suspect you could pull 300lbs out of it without making it a hoonibro race car.

S550 > S550.

[zerodameaon]

^ To bad you won't get to drive it very often because its always in the shop. /S

I am glad to see that their reliability has come leaps and bounds ahead in the past few decades. To bad its a 80 thousand dollar car, sure it will say 70k, but dealer markups will likely be significant.

Originally Posted by Matej

S550 > S550.

Hey why did you pull out the 0-60 times and such? Did you see that was for the AWD and a 7spd auto? Oh as well its also got more power, HP is about the same, but TQ is about 115 more.

[kashira kureijii]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Why is it so hard to peel apples? Bananas are super easy to peel!!


Corollas and Civics are astronomically heavier then their predecessors.

The original Miata weighted 2100lbs, the new one is 2,400lbs. Yes, it's 1,000lbs lighter then a Mustang, but it still got heavier

I know they have gotten heavier, what I'm saying is, It is possible to make a sports car that weighs as much as a 240 in 2016.

Everyones just giving manufacturers an excuse to suck at design, by blaming safety standards that obviously don't impede manufacturers abilities to make 2800 lb cars.

If a rolla can weigh 2800lb and get a 5 star safety rating, what would theoretically prevent a manufacturer from making a 2800lb sports car with an acceptable safety rating?

They just need to try harder at designing shit that doesn't suck

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by kashira kureijii

I know they have gotten heavier, what I'm saying is, It is possible to make a sports car that weighs as much as a 240 in 2016.

Everyones just giving manufacturers an excuse to suck at design, by blaming safety standards that obviously don't impede manufacturers abilities to make 2800 lb cars.

If a rolla can weigh 2800lb and get a 5 star safety rating, what would theoretically prevent a manufacturer from making a 2800lb sports car with an acceptable safety rating?

They just need to try harder at designing shit that doesn't suck

They can't because nimrods like you expect to get this mystical sports car for less than a "rolla" with twice the power. If you want a feather light sports car that's brand new go find an Atom or Lotus.

[kashira kureijii]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

They can't because nimrods like you expect to get this mystical sports car for less than a "rolla" with twice the power. If you want a feather light sports car that's brand new go find an Atom or Lotus.

who said anything about price you silly Gallic punk ?
Who wants an atom? I might tolerate a lotus just cuz it uses a toyota engine, but it would still have that terrible Limey build quality.

I mean I'd be happy with a car that has 2016 rolla weight and power, because you know, a 240 basically has 2016 rolla weight and power. the aftermarket could go from there. also they could always use one of their turbo I4's, they already have some in other vehicles.

We need a RWD rolla, one that isn't valve cover gasket leaky. I'm sure they could manage to design another RWD car after maybe a 100 million $ or so in design

[lunchmeat]

I just wish Nissan would bring back the s chassis, instead of giving us 6 different suvs.

[kingkilburn]

Gallic Punk?

You must be daft.

[Dutchmalmiss]

Originally Posted by lunchmeat

I just wish Nissan would bring back the s chassis, instead of giving us 6 different suvs.

You're preaching to the choir, bud. This thread has been non-stop wishing since it started haha.

10 year anniversary this December for this thread. Let's just fucking develop our own damn next gen s-chassis to commemorate haha.

[lunchmeat]

Originally Posted by Dutchmalmiss

You're preaching to the choir, bud. This thread has been non-stop wishing since it started haha.

10 year anniversary this December for this thread. Let's just fucking develop our own damn next gen s-chassis to commemorate haha.

I'm down. If dynacorn can do it with the mustang, then damnit someone out there should.

[kashira kureijii]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

Gallic Punk?

You must be daft.

I could have sworn you were French , must have been someone else then.

Sorry, I know how much of an insult being called French is, so I"ll retract my statement good sir.

[Yardjass]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

They can't because nimrods like you expect to get this mystical sports car for less than a "rolla" with twice the power. If you want a feather light sports car that's brand new go find an Atom or Lotus.

Not true. I would gladly pay up to 35 grand for essentially a toyoburu with an aluminum pushrod v8 in it. It would likely end up being 28 or 2900 lbs or so and seeing as that's similar to v8 pony car prices, I don't see that as unreasonable. Id go up to 30 for one with a decent turbo 4. It wouldn't have to have a fancy interior or fancy gadgets. I just want a light, fast car that feels good to drive.

The fact is they don't make anything close to this, at least not from the factory with financing and a warranty. Therefore, I'll stick to modifying old cars.

[simmode1]

Originally Posted by zombiewolf513

It doesnt run on salt water, but I would definitely be interested in this if it were to take off. Im a tech geek. I like the idea of the electric system being powered by positive and negatively charged fluids. Pretty sweet.

Yeah, the FB video I saw on this car claimed that it ran on salt water. Read up more on it and it sounds pretty cool. But I don't understand the how plentiful the fuel source is expected to be.

I mean, with the hydrogen fuel cell cars, those are powered by the most plentiful resource on earth. I don't see how the nano fuel cell is supposed to rival that.

[exitspeed]

Originally Posted by Yardjass

Not true. I would gladly pay up to 35 grand for essentially a toyoburu with an aluminum pushrod v8 in it. It would likely end up being 28 or 2900 lbs or so and seeing as that's similar to v8 pony car prices, I don't see that as unreasonable. Id go up to 30 for one with a decent turbo 4. It wouldn't have to have a fancy interior or fancy gadgets. I just want a light, fast car that feels good to drive.

The fact is they don't make anything close to this, at least not from the factory with financing and a warranty. Therefore, I'll stick to modifying old cars.

What fucking planet do you live on? Do you realize that Supra's and 300zx's were $40k+ back in the damn 90's???

Maybe you haven't been around cars or haven't been a purchaser for that long but we are in a god damn horsepower eutopia right now. There is sooooooo many bad ass cars to buy right now it's ludicrous. In the early 2000's we didn't have shit without spending $40k. And those cars are slow as shit compared to what's out now.

[exitspeed]

BTW Nissan officially bought a majority stake in Mitsubishi. What a weird turn of events.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by Yardjass

Not true. I would gladly pay up to 35 grand for essentially a toyoburu with an aluminum pushrod v8 in it. It would likely end up being 28 or 2900 lbs or so and seeing as that's similar to v8 pony car prices, I don't see that as unreasonable. Id go up to 30 for one with a decent turbo 4. It wouldn't have to have a fancy interior or fancy gadgets. I just want a light, fast car that feels good to drive.

The fact is they don't make anything close to this, at least not from the factory with financing and a warranty. Therefore, I'll stick to modifying old cars.

GT86 is already 2,805lbs.

Go back and see my break down. The GT86 uses a tinny transmission. You'd want a TR6060 in it. Now that adds 70lbs. Then a upgraded rear differential, axles, brakes, drive shaft... all easily another 100lbs. Engine would be another 100lbs.

So we're at 3,100lbs. Make the car slightly larger so it can have wider appeal, making it have a nicer interior... bigger wheels. Oh Golly, we're at 3,400lbs already. Not far off from a Camaro which even looks like a crisper modern S15.

[JesusFreakDrifter]

Originally Posted by exitspeed

BTW Nissan officially bought a majority stake in Mitsubishi. What a weird turn of events.

is that what happened? I thought they were just sharing plants. hmm. I wonder if any of Mitsubishi awd turbo goodness will rub off on Nissan.

[lunchmeat]

Originally Posted by JesusFreakDrifter

is that what happened? I thought they were just sharing plants. hmm. I wonder if any of Mitsubishi awd turbo goodness will rub off on Nissan.

Doubt it. We'll just get more minivans and mediocre economy boxes.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by kashira kureijii

who said anything about price you silly Gallic punk ?
Who wants an atom? I might tolerate a lotus just cuz it uses a toyota engine, but it would still have that terrible Limey build quality.

I mean I'd be happy with a car that has 2016 rolla weight and power, because you know, a 240 basically has 2016 rolla weight and power. the aftermarket could go from there. also they could always use one of their turbo I4's, they already have some in other vehicles.

We need a RWD rolla, one that isn't valve cover gasket leaky. I'm sure they could manage to design another RWD car after maybe a 100 million $ or so in design

Wait... you want a $25k RWD Corolla. All 2,800lbs and only 200hp?

GO BUY ONE THEN.

[zerodameaon]

Originally Posted by exitspeed

BTW Nissan officially bought a majority stake in Mitsubishi. What a weird turn of events.

Not weird, this was all planned. Mergers take a while so the conversation was likely something along these lines.

"Hey Mitsu I see you suck balls, get your price down and we will buy controlling interest" -Ghosen

"OK you should leak that we cheated on emissions testing, that will tank our stock" -Mitsubishi


Controlling interest that got bought out likely still made a crap load of money at the expense of other stockholders.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by kashira kureijii

I know they have gotten heavier, what I'm saying is, It is possible to make a sports car that weighs as much as a 240 in 2016.

You are missing the point. People want more then some BS 2,800lbs, 155hp, 15" wheeled tin can today. Yes, you can build a 2,800lbs car... it's called the FRS/BRZ/Miata/GT86.

The problem is, they are not very practical. They are not very powerful. Making 400-700hp adds weight.

I really don't understand some of these obsessions over a weight. Yes, 4,400lbs is insane. But the reality is most performance cars are 3,300 to 3,600lbs and these cars destroy their lighter vintage rivals.

Better braking, stiffer chassis, better suspension designs, better power.

[exitspeed]

Originally Posted by zerodameaon

Not weird, this was all planned. Mergers take a while so the conversation was likely something along these lines.

"Hey Mitsu I see you suck balls, get your price down and we will buy controlling interest" -Ghosen

"OK you should leak that we cheated on emissions testing, that will tank our stock" -Mitsubishi


Controlling interest that got bought out likely still made a crap load of money at the expense of other stockholders.

I know how it works. It still feels weird.

[exitspeed]

Originally Posted by Corbic

You are missing the point. People want more then some BS 2,800lbs, 155hp, 15" wheeled tin can today. Yes, you can build a 2,800lbs car... it's called the FRS/BRZ/Miata/GT86.

The problem is, they are not very practical. They are not very powerful. Making 400-700hp adds weight.

I really don't understand some of these obsessions over a weight. Yes, 4,400lbs is insane. But the reality is most performance cars are 3,300 to 3,600lbs and these cars destroy their lighter vintage rivals.

Better braking, stiffer chassis, better suspension designs, better power.

I don't agree with you all the time but this is all correct and Corbic is talking about it in just performance terms. Add in government BS regulations that manufactures have to account for (safety, mpg, etc).