The Future Automotive Thread

[exitspeed]

They only show 2 or shots of the car and one of them is someone grabbing the shifter. That strongly strongly implies it’s a manual. There would be no reason to do that shot of an auto. If anything they’d show paddle shifters or something.

I’d put real money on it being stick now.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by BryanSayWhat

Do you really think a new Silvia wouldn't gain an even bigger aftermarket world?


Why would they do that when they could just make a 4cyl Turbo Z? Also, why would S-chassis enthusiast want a new Silvia that's heavier than a current gen and probably next gen Z?

I'm sure it would be comparable to how much the 03 350Z and 04 STI cost then vs. now:

2004 WRX STI (base) - $32,000 MSRP (which would be $43,892.18 in modern times)

2020 WRX STI (base) - $36,995 MSRP

2003 Nissan 350Z (base/ MT) - $26,370 MSRP (which would be $37,133.12 in modern times)

2020 Nissan 370Z (base/ MT) - $30,090 MSRP

Um, yeah....

2003 Mustang GT 260hp
2020 Mustang GT 435hp

2003 350Z 287hp
2020 370Z 332hp

370Z has remained unchanged since 2009, the Mustang GT has had 2 chassis, 4 face lifts, 4 engines and 3 automatic transmission upgrades since then...

2003 STI 300hp + Standard BBS wheels
2020 STI 310hp + optional BBS Wheels

Sorry but the Japanese have remained fairly stagnant in the last 20 years focused on cost cutting and hybrid technology.

You can't even getting heated/cooling seats in the majority of their cars for example... (looking at you Tundra!).

[Future240]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Um, yeah....

2003 Mustang GT 260hp
2020 Mustang GT 435hp

2003 350Z 287hp
2020 370Z 332hp

370Z has remained unchanged since 2009, the Mustang GT has had 2 chassis, 4 face lifts, 4 engines and 3 automatic transmission upgrades since then...

2003 STI 300hp + Standard BBS wheels
2020 STI 310hp + optional BBS Wheels

Sorry but the Japanese have remained fairly stagnant in the last 20 years focused on cost cutting and hybrid technology.

You can't even getting heated/cooling seats in the majority of their cars for example... (looking at you Tundra!).

Facts.

A 2017 Chevy Cruze has apple car play. A 2019 Infiniti Q50 does not.

[cdlong]

Originally Posted by exitspeed

They only show 2 or shots of the car and one of them is someone grabbing the shifter. That strongly strongly implies it?s a manual. There would be no reason to do that shot of an auto. If anything they?d show paddle shifters or something.

I?d put real money on it being stick now.

I don't know what information the previous two posts on the last page are basing their conclusion on except for what you just posted. Agreed, it's going to have a manual. How many sports cars don't now aside from the corvette which has an auto because of supposed chassis limitations and the supra because of brainpower limitations. Some super cars because they are faster but that's not really the goal with this car.

[exitspeed]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Um, yeah....

2003 Mustang GT 260hp
2020 Mustang GT 435hp

2003 350Z 287hp
2020 370Z 332hp

370Z has remained unchanged since 2009, the Mustang GT has had 2 chassis, 4 face lifts, 4 engines and 3 automatic transmission upgrades since then...

2003 STI 300hp + Standard BBS wheels
2020 STI 310hp + optional BBS Wheels

Sorry but the Japanese have remained fairly stagnant in the last 20 years focused on cost cutting and hybrid technology.

You can't even getting heated/cooling seats in the majority of their cars for example... (looking at you Tundra!).

So legit question, styling aside (although they seem to be calling out the ZX with the rear which you wanted) since that?s subjective, what kind of power and weight and price are you looking for to consider this thing a success based off of the Mustang and Camaro?

For me it just needs to have Supra performance, cost and be offered in a manual. Done. If it looks as good as it seems like it?s going to even better.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by Future240

Facts.



A 2017 Chevy Cruze has apple car play. A 2019 Infiniti Q50 does not.

Yup, 2019 Tundra finally got Adroid/IPhone support.


Like, um, I thought Japan was supposed to be technologically advanced and forward thinking?

Hyundai/Kia are doing to Japan what Japan did to thr Americans and Germans.

Genesis line up is far more compelling then Infiniti and Acura and is banging on that Lexus door.

Pedestrian products, I don't see a compelling reason to get a Japanese compact over a Hyundai/Kia.

Whatever lost in resale is made up for with added content, warranty and lower initial price.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by exitspeed

So legit question, styling aside (although they seem to be calling out the ZX with the rear which you wanted) since that?s subjective, what kind of power and weight and price are you looking for to consider this thing a success based off of the Mustang and Camaro?



For me it just needs to have Supra performance, cost and be offered in a manual. Done. If it looks as good as it seems like it?s going to even better.

It needs to run neck and neck with the Big-3 Pony cars. Period.

Price, options, performance.

Japanese sports cars became a thing because by the late 80's they walked all over the domestic offerings.

In 2003 a Mustang GT had a 4.6L V8 making 260hp to the 350Zs 287hp V6. The Z walked all over the old Fox Platform in suspension, transmission, braking, etc.

Even in 2005, the Z33 matched the new 3V V8 with 300hp. I've made this point time and time again in this thread.

JDM performance peaked around 2000 and has not moved the bar since then. ~300hp V6's, 300hp Turbo-4's and no innovations or changes.

Meanwhile the rest of the world has pushed on. Corvette is now a DCCT Mid Engine supercar getting a DOHC V8 that will redline at 9k or some stupid shit....

Where's our jaw dropping FD3S, MKIV, NSX or envelope pushing VR4?

300ZX had a 300hp TT-V6 in 1988....

[kingkilburn]

So you want the Z to be a GTR. Noted.

The Z is not a halo car. The Z is not a muscle car. The Z is not a pony car(which never was a thing in the first place). The Z never should have been a grand tourer, necessitating the SX.

The Z, at it's best, is a low mid entry level sports car that punches above its weight with balance and refinement. It should be everything the BRZ could be with a turbo. It should be everything the Supra should be without the BMW bloat and with a proper manual transmission. The Z should make you think Boxster not Boss.

We already had our Z32 revival. I hope they reach further back and give us something more akin to the R32 or S30.

[kingkilburn]

Nissan should bring back the Cefiro as a long wheelbase coupe with a V8 to match the muscle car crowd. Long, low, wide, with a vk rumble. People would eat that shit up.

Edit
I figured it out. Make me an executive.
Z compact 2 seat fastback with Altima turbo 4
Skyline 2+2 coupe with q60t engine
Cefiro 2+3 super coupe/ 4 door with a vk

All on the same chassis, effectively the same car. Fuck any Infiniti overlap. It's a dead brand.

[deolio]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

Nissan should bring back the Cefiro as a long wheelbase coupe with a V8 to match the muscle car crowd. Long, low, wide, with a vk rumble. People would eat that shit up.

Edit
I figured it out. Make me an executive.
Z compact 2 seat fastback with Altima turbo 4
Skyline 2+2 coupe with q60t engine
Cefiro 2+3 super coupe/ 4 door with a vk

All on the same chassis, effectively the same car. Fuck any Infiniti overlap. It's a dead brand.

so, a 86, rcf, and lcf situation, but that competes with itself more?

[kingkilburn]

Would you say that the F150 2 door 2wd short bed competes with the F350 quad cab 4wd dually long bed? When you conceive of them as different packages of the same model it's all sales.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

Nissan should bring back the Cefiro as a long wheelbase coupe with a V8 to match the muscle car crowd. Long, low, wide, with a vk rumble. People would eat that shit up.

Edit
I figured it out. Make me an executive.
Z compact 2 seat fastback with Altima turbo 4
Skyline 2+2 coupe with q60t engine
Cefiro 2+3 super coupe/ 4 door with a vk

All on the same chassis, effectively the same car. Fuck any Infiniti overlap. It's a dead brand.

So they'll all fail.

Your Z will be bloated (like the Z33/34), the Skyline will fail to catch on and the Cefiero will be over priced and still get its ass smacked by the domestics.

[kingkilburn]

Seriously Corbic, why do you ever log into Zilvia? You don't like anything about Nissan, now or when S chassis was relevant. It's like your life's purpose is just to vomit on anything you can find. It renders your opinions worthless and sidelines every discussion. It's tiring dude.

[BryanSayWhat]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Um, yeah....

2003 Mustang GT 260hp
2020 Mustang GT 435hp

2003 350Z 287hp
2020 370Z 332hp

370Z has remained unchanged since 2009, the Mustang GT has had 2 chassis, 4 face lifts, 4 engines and 3 automatic transmission upgrades since then...

2003 STI 300hp + Standard BBS wheels
2020 STI 310hp + optional BBS Wheels

Sorry but the Japanese have remained fairly stagnant in the last 20 years focused on cost cutting and hybrid technology.

You can't even getting heated/cooling seats in the majority of their cars for example... (looking at you Tundra!).

You must of not read what I was replying to and yet at the same time proved my point...

If Nissan still made the S15 Spec R it wouldn't cost close to $40,000.

Originally Posted by cdlong

I don't know what information the previous two posts on the last page are basing their conclusion on except for what you just posted. Agreed, it's going to have a manual.

Did you mistakenly think I posted it didn't look like a manual?

Originally Posted by Corbic

It needs to run neck and neck with the Big-3 Pony cars. Period.

Price, options, performance.

Japanese sports cars became a thing because by the late 80's they walked all over the domestic offerings.

In 2003 a Mustang GT had a 4.6L V8 making 260hp to the 350Zs 287hp V6. The Z walked all over the old Fox Platform in suspension, transmission, braking, etc.

Even in 2005, the Z33 matched the new 3V V8 with 300hp. I've made this point time and time again in this thread.

JDM performance peaked around 2000 and has not moved the bar since then. ~300hp V6's, 300hp Turbo-4's and no innovations or changes.

Meanwhile the rest of the world has pushed on. Corvette is now a DCCT Mid Engine supercar getting a DOHC V8 that will redline at 9k or some stupid shit....

Where's our jaw dropping FD3S, MKIV, NSX or envelope pushing VR4?

300ZX had a 300hp TT-V6 in 1988....

Everything you say is great when it comes to drag racing, 1 mile pull racing and big open circuit racing. The thing is, there's still people out there that want a fast balanced car for driving on narrow winding roads.

In that environment you don't need 500+hp & 3500lb+ RWD muscle cars.

The reason "JDM performance peaked around 2000" was that formula was a great balance for daily driven cars that liked to drive spirited through "narrow winding roads". People still want that formula today regardless of how much HP other modern cars have.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by BryanSayWhat

You must of not read what I was replying to and yet at the same time proved my point...



If Nissan still made the S15 Spec R it wouldn't cost close to $40,000.



Did you mistakenly think I posted it didn't look like a manual?



Everything you say is great when it comes to drag racing, 1 mile pull racing and big open circuit racing. The thing is, there's still people out there that want a fast balanced car for driving on narrow winding roads.



In that environment you don't need 500+hp & 3500lb+ RWD muscle cars.



The reason "JDM performance peaked around 2000" was that formula was a great balance for daily driven cars that liked to drive spirited through "narrow winding roads". People still want that formula today regardless of how much HP other modern cars have.

I have to disagree.

The "Super Sports Cars" pushed the boundaries of power, performance, breaking and technology.

You had Honda Civics that made more horse power then V8's and dominated drag strips back then. So it's not that the cars where all cutie Miatas.

We also still have a who slew of cutie Miata, Minis, Fiats and Fiestas if that's your game...

The original 240Z was a poor man's Ferrari/Daytona/Jaguar. 151hp OHC 2.4L straight six, IRS, this car was bench marked against the Porsche 911, not a damn MG Midget. It posted a freaking Quarter Mile of 15.5 in 1970!!! Does a damn GT86 even do that in 2020!?? (50 years later!)

It had always been Nissan Halo car in the US.

So if you got this backwards. Your looking for a Miata / FRZGTBZ86 fighter... That is not what thr Z had ever been.

Nissan needs to be bench marking the Mercedes GT, Porsche 911, Corvette and Jaguar F-Type.

How to give them a run for the money at a fraction of the price?

This is exactly what Ford did with the Boss 302 vs M3 and GT350 vs Porsche 911.

Toyota could have had a Boxster/Cayman killer had they gave the FRZBG86T 300 dayum horsepower.

T(u) RD/ST(d) I addition for $40k. Monster brakes, 330hp, fancy wheels, Mag-ride suspension, gloat all the way to the top of the charts.

NOPE. We like getting passed by minivans on our shitty Prius tires.

Again, it's not cause they reached the peak of balance. If that was the case the Z wouldn't be bloated and numb, the S2K would have had a successor and a GTwhatever would have a turbo 255hp engine like the S15.

What happened is all the old farts that designed these amazing machines in the late 80's retired. They got replaced by bean counters freaking out about economic uncertainty and nerds that had no interest in cars wanting to push CVTs and Hybrids.

Where are those sporty fun to drive economy cars like the B13, EG, EK, EMand DC2? Gone. Replaced with numb CVTs, lifeless motors and torsion rear suspension.

[kingkilburn]

I should annotate that entire post to show how bullshit you are. 1970s Nissan benchmarked 1970s Z against 1970s 911. But 2020 Nissan shouldn't benchmark a 2020 Z against a Boxster? Get the fuck out of here. That's precisely the Z experience. If you want your modern 911 in name to name only comparison Nissan literally already makes a goddam GTR. Go buy that shit if you want crazy high tech no detail is too expensive halo bullshit. I want a small rwd sports car that I drive not a nuclear bomb on wheels that I suggest where the computers shuttle me to.

Absolute bullshit. Not even consistent through put off bullshit.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

I should annotate that entire post to show how bullshit you are. 1970s Nissan benchmarked 1970s Z against 1970s 911. But 2020 Nissan shouldn't benchmark a 2020 Z against a Boxster? Get the fuck out of here. That's precisely the Z experience. If you want your modern 911 in name to name only comparison Nissan literally already makes a goddam GTR. Go buy that shit if you want crazy high tech no detail is too expensive halo bullshit. I want a small rwd sports car that I drive not a nuclear bomb on wheels that I suggest where the computers shuttle me to.

Absolute bullshit. Not even consistent through put off bullshit.

Go buy a Miata and be done with it then.

Also, the Porsche Boxster of the 70's is the 914. Nice try.

[deolio]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

Would you say that the F150 2 door 2wd short bed competes with the F350 quad cab 4wd dually long bed? When you conceive of them as different packages of the same model it's all sales.

I see your point, but I'd say it's more of a f150 vs f250 or f250 vs f350 kind of a thing. Pickup trucks account for 8x as many sales as sports cars, so not quite a fair comparison. For trucks, I understand the need for the mid-level option, but sports cars not so much, unless it's at least 15-20k price gap between base models (ie. 86, rc, lc) and that chassis would have to be some serious wizardry to be versatile enough to suit all three.

[kingkilburn]

I bought a BRZ because I was tired of waiting for Nissan to give me an option. When I'm satisfied I've paid enough off and burned through enough of the seven year warranty it's getting a turbo. Had a turbo option been available I'd gladly have upgraded.

While you talk yourself in circles everyone else can see, Nissan can easily make a car of similar size to the S30 and later S chassis with that same 300ish horse power for $35kish to $45kish that would satisfy everyone.

I'd love to be put in a position to have to think hard about keeping this car vs selling it for a Z.

[exitspeed]

Yeah MT even says the video hints at it being a manual.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[cdlong]

Originally Posted by BryanSayWhat

Did you mistakenly think I posted it didn't look like a manual?

No. It didn't LOOK like anything. There's not enough information in the video to conclude either way. Only the implication from bothering to show the shifter at all is there any indication of a manual transmission.

[Future240]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

I bought a BRZ because I was tired of waiting for Nissan to give me an option. When I'm satisfied I've paid enough off and burned through enough of the seven year warranty it's getting a turbo. Had a turbo option been available I'd gladly have upgraded.

While you talk yourself in circles everyone else can see, Nissan can easily make a car of similar size to the S30 and later S chassis with that same 300ish horse power for $35kish to $45kish that would satisfy everyone.

I'd love to be put in a position to have to think hard about keeping this car vs selling it for a Z.

You plan on doing a full build (cosworth block etc) or just go NA-T?

[kingkilburn]

From what I can tell the weak link internally is the rods, and externally the lack of an oil cooler. I suppose the question is how deep do you get into it once you've pull the engine and split the block.

I think In this car I'd be happy to have 300ish hp with little to no modifications outside of the turbo kit itself. No need for injectors, fuel pump, stand alone, yada yada yada. I'm still keeping the S13, I guess it gets to be the stupid almost track only never ending build.

[BryanSayWhat]

Originally Posted by cdlong

No. It didn't LOOK like anything. There's not enough information in the video to conclude either way. Only the implication from bothering to show the shifter at all is there any indication of a manual transmission.

I was going to type out pretty much the same thing exitspeed said after me, but went the lazy route with "Looks like a manual to me." .

Nissan going through the trouble of showing the hand on the shifter "screams" M/T...

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

From what I can tell the weak link internally is the rods, and externally the lack of an oil cooler. I suppose the question is how deep do you get into it once you've pull the engine and split the block.

I think In this car I'd be happy to have 300ish hp with little to no modifications outside of the turbo kit itself. No need for injectors, fuel pump, stand alone, yada yada yada. I'm still keeping the S13, I guess it gets to be the stupid almost track only never ending build.

Pretty much my same dilemma. I've wanted a stock EVO/ STI since the initial US releases. So far I've owned my 15 STI for just over a year and it's proven to be the reliable and fun DD I've always wanted.

My warranty is up in 2yrs and I'm debating whether I should go simple tune only, bolt-ons + tune for around 325-345whp, or just save up and get a built 400whp engine with reliability being the main goal.

[cdlong]

Fair enough.

[exitspeed]

And boom goes the dynamite.



Shots fired Toyota.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[exitspeed]

https://www.instagram.com/p/CE9MDtrj...d=dyr0klzslbm7

Another tester with some more shots. I’m fucking diggin this thing. I hope they don’t wait to do Nismo edition livery options.

[Dutchmalmiss]

Originally Posted by exitspeed

https://www.instagram.com/p/CE9MDtrj...d=dyr0klzslbm7

Another tester with some more shots. I?m fucking diggin this thing. I hope they don?t wait to do Nismo edition livery options.

I love that they finally brought in the S30's best qualities in the rear quarter panel and long hood. Wouldn't mind those wheels either. My preference is hoping it would be a 2+2, but it wouldn't be a dealbreaker. I don't hear a turbo-spool during that start-up/rev sequence though.

[Future240]

Originally Posted by BryanSayWhat

Pretty much my same dilemma. I've wanted a stock EVO/ STI since the initial US releases. So far I've owned my 15 STI for just over a year and it's proven to be the reliable and fun DD I've always wanted.

My warranty is up in 2yrs and I'm debating whether I should go simple tune only, bolt-ons + tune for around 325-345whp, or just save up and get a built 400whp engine with reliability being the main goal.

How long would the ringlands last at that time of whp?

I've always wanted an STI but the ringland issue has kinda scared me away. I have settled on picking up a Q50 next year when my bonus comes.

430whp is possible with bolt ons. Sadly auto only.

[kingkilburn]

The lack of manual transmissions in anything remotely exciting was a big factor in leading me where I ended up. Nissan makes perhaps the best rwd manual transmission and somehow the Z is the only car with it. Q60 with that transmission is an obvious buy even if I'm not in love with the styling.