The Future Automotive Thread

[kanyedian]

Originally Posted by simmode1

What? The Juke-R?

Haha I see a few NISMO Jukes running around town lol

[spooled240]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Wrong.

The Japanese have their heads up their asses and are stuck in the 90's. You can see this all over the comments by that Toybaru team and the emphasis on "balance".

That car would be making 600whp if it was from a domestic or European manufacturer. How is it any different then a Corvette or 911?

Toyota could have dropped a EZ30R or EZ36 and people would have been ecstatic. Flat six bumble, 250-275hp and really no sacrifice to fuel economy. Bump the price $3,500 and run laughing to the bank.

F6 is like 2" longer then the F4 engines and fits all day.

I don't know if I would agree with that. The Japanese in the 90's had their fair share of iron block I6's, v6's, I4's with heavy turbo/twin turbo setups. I'd say the Japanese in the 90's were more concerned with packing their cars with technology like AWD, AWS, sequential TT, V-TEC, VVT, etc.


Now, "balance" seems like an excuse for using a small neutered engine. I think it's funny when people say you don't need 300hp, but I find power being more useful than 50/50 weight distribution. I'm fine with 60/40 if I have some hp or some torque to drive to the store lol.

[Corbic]

All those JDM engines topped out at 280-320hp back in the late 80's and 90's.

Today, all the Japanese engines are still making 280-320hp.

Meanwhile the US and Germany are shitting out 600hp monsters with regularity.

[feito]

Originally Posted by spooled240

I don't know if I would agree with that. The Japanese in the 90's had their fair share of iron block I6's, v6's, I4's with heavy turbo/twin turbo setups. I'd say the Japanese in the 90's were more concerned with packing their cars with technology like AWD, AWS, sequential TT, V-TEC, VVT, etc.


Now, "balance" seems like an excuse for using a small neutered engine. I think it's funny when people say you don't need 300hp, but I find power being more useful than 50/50 weight distribution. I'm fine with 60/40 if I have some hp or some torque to drive to the store lol.

They're packing cars with tech even more nowadays, they just have switched their focus from engine tech to autonomy and safety tech, which i find pretty gay...
And as much as i hate AV's, when you look at drivers on the street, you know autonomy is unstopable. 7 out of 10 people arent even looking at the road, always on the phone and none enjoy driving. A little more improvement and AV's will be safer than humans... I read that some kids nowadays arent even interested in learning how to drive ffs! So autonomy is here, and with it will come many new restrictions and laws. They will come for our cars eventually, our hobby. I just hope it takes them a few more decades, or else they will only take my steering wheels from my cold dead hands

[kanyedian]

Originally Posted by Corbic

All those JDM engines topped out at 280-320hp back in the late 80's and 90's.

Today, all the Japanese engines are still making 280-320hp.

Meanwhile the US and Germany are shitting out 600hp monsters with regularity.

Unless you mean for the JDM, then that's not true.
Lexus RCF, Infiniti Q60 Red Sport, Nissan GT-R, Honda NSX, etc.

Originally Posted by feito

They're packing cars with tech even more nowadays, they just have switched their focus from engine tech to autonomy and safety tech, which i find pretty ***...
And as much as i hate AV's, when you look at drivers on the street, you know autonomy is unstopable. 7 out of 10 people arent even looking at the road, always on the phone and none enjoy driving. A little more improvement and AV's will be safer than humans... I read that some kids nowadays arent even interested in learning how to drive ffs! So autonomy is here, and with it will come many new restrictions and laws. They will come for our cars eventually, our hobby. I just hope it takes them a few more decades, or else they will only take my steering wheels from my cold dead hands

I definitely see a future for autonomous veh. It would be nice in certain cities to summon a veh using your phone and ride it to your destination, then get out and it leaves to get someone else. A lot like the rideshare programs but without a human driver.

That would keep a lot of costs down that are accompanied with veh ownership.

I would worry about them coming for manned internal combustion engines in the future as well. That is what the Left and Right will argue about creating legislation for in 100 years. At lease motorsport still exists and most people don't understand the developmental function it plays for road cars.

[drift freaq]

That Titan warrior looks bad ass and Would have been a definite challenge to an F150 Raptor!

[exitspeed]

Originally Posted by kanyedian

Unless you mean for the JDM, then that's not true.
Lexus RCF, Infiniti Q60 Red Sport, Nissan GT-R, Honda NSX, etc.

What are you talking about JDM, all those cars are available here and elsewhere.

I think Corbics point is back in the 90’s Japanese cars were making 280-320hp and they were kicking the domestic autos asses. Now however, GM, Ford and FCA have $30k cars with 400hp. The Z, FRS are $30k+ and they’re 350hp and a measly 200hp.

Yes there are the RCF, GTR, NSX, etc but those are virtually six figure cars.

Meanwhile the Mustang and Camaro in that price range (hell even the Camaro SS1LE destroys most of those cars) produce far more hp and destroy those cars in almost every way.

His point, and the point that has been made countless times in this thread over the last 10 years, is that Japanese manufactures are behind the times and not competitive (in this aspect).

[feito]

Its all about that gentlemen's agreement (japs accent).
Arigato

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by exitspeed

What are you talking about JDM, all those cars are available here and elsewhere.



I think Corbics point is back in the 90’s Japanese cars were making 280-320hp and they were kicking the domestic autos asses. Now however, GM, Ford and FCA have $30k cars with 400hp. The Z, FRS are $30k+ and they’re 350hp and a measly 200hp.



Yes there are the RCF, GTR, NSX, etc but those are virtually six figure cars.



Meanwhile the Mustang and Camaro in that price range (hell even the Camaro SS1LE destroys most of those cars) produce far more hp and destroy those cars in almost every way.



His point, and the point that has been made countless times in this thread over the last 10 years, is that Japanese manufactures are behind the times and not competitive (in this aspect).

Bingo.

Even new designs like the Type-R is 306hp (a 90's number) compared to a Focus RS at 350hp.

STI is still only 310hp, a number it achieved in the US back in 2004. Prior it was 280hp in the 90's with special editions making upwards of 320hp.

It's stagnation, and it's something you see across all of Japan's industries and economy.

Who makes the hottest Cellphones? Best selling video games? Hottest computers, radios, software, cameras, etc.

Even the tuning industry is absolutely dominated by US tuners. Who's the hottest Subaru and GTR handheld? It's not Apexi, HKS, Tomei, Blitz... It's Cobb.

Tomei a few years ago had a weak sauce push for hard parts, but beyond that, not a lot going on over there.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by feito

Its all about that gentlemen's agreement (japs accent).
Arigato

Which was to keep the Japanese Government from putting laws in place restricting designs.

No reason you can't build and sell more powerful versions in the largest markets in the world. They could also do what the Germans do, sell detuned versions, which is easy to do with turbo vehicles.

[kanyedian]

Originally Posted by exitspeed

What are you talking about JDM, all those cars are available here and elsewhere.

I was trying to help him out by suggesting he meant only in Japan, because I gave examples of cars with more than 320hp available elsewhere.

Originally Posted by exitspeed

His point, and the point that has been made countless times in this thread over the last 10 years, is that Japanese manufactures are behind the times and not competitive (in this aspect).

Yeth. Everybody knows this

[kanyedian]

Originally Posted by Corbic

It's stagnation, and it's something you see across all of Japan's industries and economy.

They just don't seem to be so focused with performance anymore. Taking a greater interest in fuel economy and hybridization/alternative fuel methods.

I don't see that as an extremely horrible eventuality, however. Given the performance of Tesla and BeVs generally. It would be nice if they offered some hybrid or electric sports car. The Prius certainly won't be burning up any road courses any time soon

[ronmcdon]

to be fair I think the miata has continued to evolve. the current one is much more of performer AND hasnt gotten bloated with weight or uncessary tech.

the civic type r is an eyesore for many, and from a performance standpoint it is a lot quicker car compared to what it was in the 90s.

the other japanese options I agree have stagnated and not aged well. one thing I do like about the 370z is that it doesnt seem to have gotten more expensive and may even be cheaper today when adjusted for inflation.

[simmode1]

Originally Posted by kanyedian

It would be nice if they offered some hybrid or electric sports car.

Telsa Roadster, BMW i8 are couple I can think of right off the top of my head. I'm certain there are others at this point as well. But maybe, if by "they" you mean JDM entry level hybrid or full electric vehicles, yeah there's some work left to do. The NSX is hybrid though.

[kanyedian]

Originally Posted by ronmcdon

to be fair I think the miata has continued to evolve. the current one is much more of performer AND hasnt gotten bloated with weight or uncessary tech.

the civic type r is an eyesore for many, and from a performance standpoint it is a lot quicker car compared to what it was in the 90s.

the other japanese options I agree have stagnated and not aged well. one thing I do like about the 370z is that it doesnt seem to have gotten more expensive and may even be cheaper today when adjusted for inflation.

Hmm true.. I definitely love the new MX-5. Looks so mean. And I'm into the Fiat 124 as well. I was at a Nissan dealership the other day and boy they had an auto 370Z and sticker was like $47k GOLLIE! Mustang GT > 370Z for that price range.

Originally Posted by simmode1

Telsa Roadster, BMW i8 are couple I can think of right off the top of my head. I'm certain there are others at this point as well. But maybe, if by "they" you mean JDM entry level hybrid or full electric vehicles, yeah there's some work left to do. The NSX is hybrid though.

Yeah but those are super expensive. Would be nice to see a cool vert or coupé for like Prius money. But manufacturers may feel the hybrid and bev markets are mostly for grocery getters atm. But I believe that will change over time.

[simmode1]

Originally Posted by kanyedian

Yeah but those are super expensive. Would be nice to see a cool vert or coupé for like Prius money. But manufacturers may feel the hybrid and bev markets are mostly for grocery getters atm. But I believe that will change over time.

I don't know, man. We hit a hayday where the entry level sports car came back hard AF and hit like a ton of bricks. But seems like they're on the decline again. I imagine the case study for an entry level hybrid or electric sports car would be a tough sell when even conventional ones are barely selling unless your name is Mustang or Camaro.

[kanyedian]

Originally Posted by simmode1

I don't know, man. We hit a hayday where the entry level sports car came back hard AF and hit like a ton of bricks. But seems like they're on the decline again. I imagine the case study for an entry level hybrid or electric sports car would be a tough sell when even conventional ones are barely selling unless your name is Mustang or Camaro.

Yeah that makes sense. Maybe the generations that really appreciated sports cars are getting older and just buying crossovers. (My parents fall into this category - dad grew up with muscle cars and just had a Rav4 {although he did slide into a new Chrysler 300 last year.})

There is going to be a similar problem with Harley soon as well. The people that buy those bikes new (most are just south of $20,000) are all 60 years old. They won't be able to ride much longer. And 20-somethings aren't that interested in cruisers. I can see the day when that company shuts down altogether. Kind of sad but hey, that's the nature of things. They tend to end.

[simmode1]

Originally Posted by kanyedian

Maybe the generations that really appreciated sports cars are getting older and just buying crossovers.... And 20-somethings aren't that interested in cruisers.

Don't believe the hype. Young ppl still want cool sports cars and motorcycles. They just can't afford shit, collectively.

[kanyedian]

Yeah and I've made a conscious decision to buy preowned vehicles for a while. I like that I can get something that, new, would be out of my league, but now I can skrrt in it for teh lowz. Always searching for those deals and I was set on a ~2015 GT vert in black with a chassis wide and wide body.. But then I found this S a few weeks ago and it checked so many of my boxes (RWD, vert, manual, RHD) that it's goals AF. So don't need anything else for a while.


I'm intrigued by some of these electric motorcycles coming out though; especially the SuperMoto variants:

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by simmode1

Don't believe the hype. Young ppl still want cool sports cars and motorcycles. They just can't afford shit, collectively.

Don't belive the hype, young people can afford shit, they just want to cry and not work.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by kanyedian

Yeah and I've made a conscious decision to buy preowned vehicles for a while. I like that I can get something that, new, would be out of my league, but now I can skrrt in it for teh lowz. Always searching for those deals and I was set on a ~2015 GT vert in black with a chassis wide and wide body.. But then I found this S a few weeks ago and it checked so many of my boxes (RWD, vert, manual, RHD) that it's goals AF. So don't need anything else for a while.





I'm intrigued by some of these electric motorcycles coming out though; especially the SuperMoto variants:

Vomit.

Goodluck getting laid on an oversized scooter.

https://www.instagram.com/tv/BxFXjoM...d=yltmc7df88og

[kanyedian]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Lovely.

Goodluck getting laid on an oversized scooter.

That's why you ride?

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by kanyedian

That's why you ride?

Anything cool is only cool because you either can get hurt or get laid.

That's why a Honda CBR6 is cooler than a Honda Rebel.

A motorcycle is all about the symbiotic relationship of man and machine. Strip out the thundering engine and your left with an overpriced electric scooter. I don't give a shit how fast it is, Motorcycles are already stupid fast.

Hell my shit box Dyna 88 will spank an FRS without much effort.



Braaaaaappppp

[kanyedian]

Much vroom. Very brap. Such skrrt.

My Wideglide is fun from a dig. Tops out at 100mph though and gets sketchy from the aerodynamics of the 16" apes aha. But that bike isn't about all out speed.

Just got a GSX-S750 naked last winter and that thing is awesome. Selling my ZX-6R to make room for the S13 (in my bank account). But I know I'm asking too much because I haven't received any CL messages

[BOROSUN]

i have a duc m1200s. i dont mind having a fast electric bike. i recently got on a live wire that response is nothing like it. hopefully electric bikes will get lighter ,longer distance and more affordable.

[kanyedian]

One guy raced a dirtbike version (I think it was an Alta or a Zero) at Red Bull Straight Rhythm and performed OK. No one has tried to enter into Supercross or Motocross with one though. That would be either interesting or very embarrassing. It's pretty much up to the rider though. Some guys can just haul absolute ass on the track.

[exitspeed]

Originally Posted by kanyedian

Yeah that makes sense. Maybe the generations that really appreciated sports cars are getting older and just buying crossovers.

That’s definitely my situation. My reason though is I have 3 kids. I need practicality atm. If I didn’t have kids though I’d definitely be driving a brand new Vette over my new Volvo. That’s life.

Besides that none of the “sports” cars on the market are home runs for me. If Toyota announces a manual Supra I may bite.

[simmode1]

^^^Manual Supra would sooo be tits. I'm not in love with the idea of $55k for 335hp when Mustangs, Camaros and Corvettes are a thing, but there's a lot of tuning potential to be tapped from that ugly ass engine bay.

[exitspeed]

Originally Posted by simmode1

^^^Manual Supra would sooo be tits. I'm not in love with the idea of $55k for 335hp when Mustangs, Camaros and Corvettes are a thing, but there's a lot of tuning potential to be tapped from that ugly ass engine bay.

Yeah, it’s not a home run. It’s not a car I NEED. It’s close and I think it’s faults can be fixed.

This is all that’s on my mind right now though.



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[Corbic]

I'll pass on the China Mobile.