This is the roll center, suspension pickup, and steering angle modification thread. - Page 123 - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

TheRealSy90 · 02-09-2012, 04:56 PM

^I like that. Was planning on doing the same thing.

marks14 · 02-09-2012, 05:08 PM

I like the one piece lca/tension rod, how thick is the mount for the top of the shock? It looks thin from those angles.

drift937 · 02-09-2012, 05:24 PM

1/4" plate with gussets

!Zar! · 02-09-2012, 06:00 PM

Ohh. How much is that?

Chris28 · 02-09-2012, 09:19 PM

So it's basically a FD legal Wisefab kit...I like it. Thinking about making more to sell?

Wisefab · 02-10-2012, 03:19 AM

Hi to everybody. I am Ardo from Wisefab and wanted to say, that it's a great forum and we also have been keeping our eye on it to see peoples response to our creations. Thank you all for your comments!
I just wanted to point out some things about the PeeBee kit shown in the previous page, that it is by far not the first kit using add-on. We released our BMW kit now a year ago and it uses the add-on. After our kit was released we have seen some other to follow that path aswell. We have upgraded our kit alot now and see alot of problems with the newcomers stuff, that we also struggled with and the last design we are selling now is final and now we are moving on, on the BMW lineup.
About our Nissan kit and why we did'nt use the add-on in there. We wanted to push the design, kinematics and lock to the furthest and craziest levels ever seen in drifting. Also the fact that Nissans stock suspension needed alot of correcting to be able to withstand levels we wanted, so we went with the full knuckle design. I guess we pushed the boundaries too far, so our kit is now illegal in few series and closes up the US market for our Nissan kits aswell. Not to worrie, US legal kit is allready in the making and we release it in a month or two.
We keep pushing the boundaries in the future in the kinematics and lock aswell.

Ardo
Wisefab.com

drift937 · 02-10-2012, 04:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris28

So it's basically a FD legal Wisefab kit...I like it. Thinking about making more to sell?

Yea I sell these as a kit. I also sell them by the piece. I don't want to post pricing in this thread b/c I am not a vendor anymore. You can pm me for any questions if you like

NismoPlsr · 02-10-2012, 05:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wisefab

Hi to everybody. I am Ardo from Wisefab and wanted to say, that it's a great forum and we also have been keeping our eye on it to see peoples response to our creations. Thank you all for your comments!
I just wanted to point out some things about the PeeBee kit shown in the previous page, that it is by far not the first kit using add-on. We released our BMW kit now a year ago and it uses the add-on. After our kit was released we have seen some other to follow that path aswell. We have upgraded our kit alot now and see alot of problems with the newcomers stuff, that we also struggled with and the last design we are selling now is final and now we are moving on, on the BMW lineup.
About our Nissan kit and why we did'nt use the add-on in there. We wanted to push the design, kinematics and lock to the furthest and craziest levels ever seen in drifting. Also the fact that Nissans stock suspension needed alot of correcting to be able to withstand levels we wanted, so we went with the full knuckle design. I guess we pushed the boundaries too far, so our kit is now illegal in few series and closes up the US market for our Nissan kits aswell. Not to worrie, US legal kit is allready in the making and we release it in a month or two.
We keep pushing the boundaries in the future in the kinematics and lock aswell.

Ardo
Wisefab.com

Welcome to the forums, Ardo! It's nice to have info direct from the source.

Good news for all the Formula D guys, as well.

Be sure to become a Zilvia vendor if you want to be able to advertize and sell your products here.

nassin31spr · 02-10-2012, 05:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hOngsterr

so which side sticks out further?

My drivers side wheel sticks out further. I figured maybe the previous owner ran it off the road and bent the drivers side lca. But I've been searching and it seems to be a very common problem with s13's that go unnoticed til you lower the vehicle. I'm going to get some lca's an I'll post up if it fix's the problem. Just wanted to see of anyone lately has that problem.

DC Dan MAX USA · 02-10-2012, 02:40 PM

That white LCA / tenrod combo, looks like its really easy to bend on dirt drop and flex while driving with the arched tenrod and the length of the unsupported LCA tube. Any track testing or collision experience on that one before it went up for sale?

GripTerror · 02-10-2012, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wisefab

Hi to everybody. I am Ardo from Wisefab and wanted to say, that it's a great forum and we also have been keeping our eye on it to see peoples response to our creations. Thank you all for your comments!
I just wanted to point out some things about the PeeBee kit shown in the previous page, that it is by far not the first kit using add-on. We released our BMW kit now a year ago and it uses the add-on. After our kit was released we have seen some other to follow that path aswell. We have upgraded our kit alot now and see alot of problems with the newcomers stuff, that we also struggled with and the last design we are selling now is final and now we are moving on, on the BMW lineup.
About our Nissan kit and why we did'nt use the add-on in there. We wanted to push the design, kinematics and lock to the furthest and craziest levels ever seen in drifting. Also the fact that Nissans stock suspension needed alot of correcting to be able to withstand levels we wanted, so we went with the full knuckle design. I guess we pushed the boundaries too far, so our kit is now illegal in few series and closes up the US market for our Nissan kits aswell. Not to worrie, US legal kit is allready in the making and we release it in a month or two.
We keep pushing the boundaries in the future in the kinematics and lock aswell.

Ardo
Wisefab.com

Will you only be building drift only parts or will you ever consider producing some nifty grip oriented track stuff?

drift937 · 02-10-2012, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DC Dan MAX USA

That white LCA / tenrod combo, looks like its really easy to bend on dirt drop and flex while driving with the arched tenrod and the length of the unsupported LCA tube. Any track testing or collision experience on that one before it went up for sale?

They are on my track car now. Construction is 1.5" .120 wall dom tubing. I stress tested them in a 50 ton hydraulic press. They will be fine

mikerbike · 02-10-2012, 11:13 PM

Finally got around to extending my front control arms and got a front crossmember with the rack mounts moved forward. I haven't had a chance to go brifting yet. I added 1.5". I should have added an inch. Oh well.

Wisefab · 02-11-2012, 01:45 PM

We are not sure about the circuitracing stuff, if there is enaugh market for these. For sure our engineer would be more then glad to make them, with his background from all the major circuitracing series all over the world, but there would be no point of making him work for few months for something, we could only sell two kits of.

About the white stuff, i am afraid that Dan is right, it can't take a hit. For example on our parts, one guy jumped on to the side of the track on the red-white stones, broke the axle and steering shaft into half, but our stuff was straight and ready to go, so he found the new shaft and axle from the city and qualified for the main event. Also have the "test" done with 100 + km/h wheel straight into the rock test done, slightely bent the arm, but everything else was fine, replaced the arm and ready for racing again.

Happy drifting!

Ardo

drift937 · 02-11-2012, 02:20 PM

a guy breaking a tie rod on your setup has nothing to do with my setup. i guarantee my work. regardless i could care less who thinks they know what is going on with it. like i said, it will be fine

Wisefab · 02-11-2012, 02:51 PM

Take it easy man! I am not trying to put you off (hey everybody have done this to us), just to see whats going on and where and how have you tested this. Who has broken a tie rod with our setup? Just say what engineering programs have you used with it and what different forces do you see coming towards it and how much can they withstand and it will be ok.
Chill, we are not here to put anybody off, just giving advice.

drift937 · 02-11-2012, 03:18 PM

i stress tested them in a 50 ton press with dies at the point i found to be the "weak" points. for them to bend you would have to hit a curb straight on doing like 70 or 80mph. as for engineering programs... the only computer stuff i use is cad to draw up parts to laser cut. engineering is a estimated guess. sitting in the seat and feeling what does what in driving conditions is all the engineering program i need. i am a licensed driver, not a engineer. i wasnt trying to get shitty with you.i actually like your e30 kit and was thinking about it for my own car. i thought you were talking a bout breaking a tie rod but looking back it was an axle. but its whatever.

GripTerror · 02-11-2012, 03:47 PM

hey wisefab dude (whatever your real name

) Would you be interested in seeing interest then in building a setup for a circuit racing/grip oriented type crowd if there was interest?? There are a few forums namely one of them being nissanroadracing, timeattackforums and a few others that build serious track cars that just might bite the bullet on something legit, on nrr, there are a few engineers which will happily criticize your product as well :P One of them is on here Def hehe

slw240sx · 02-11-2012, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marks14

I like the one piece lca/tension rod, how thick is the mount for the top of the shock? It looks thin from those angles.

id also point out that i think the top plate in the picture may seem a little thin, and cody can correct me if i am off, but this was one of the prototype test plates that the material is thin in certain spots and was beefed up on newer designs of the plates.

cody, you can always have dave put them into his FEA software and do virtual stress tests side by side you guys driving on them, that might help with the people that doubt the strength of it. might as well have all the engineering support behind it if you have it available to you.

Jon

Wisefab · 02-11-2012, 04:20 PM

Hi, my name is loud and clear few posts up. Seriously, i am not here to pick a fight, just trying to point out some things (do not forget, we are illegal in states ....

for now

) Just few pointers are, that whatever we have done, it works really different in racing situations then in the garage. Just try to brake it and you will see things in different light.

Critisize away on our parts, we allways take it in serious consideration and try to learn from it, not to just put it off or fight it.

drift937 · 02-11-2012, 04:23 PM

the one pictured is not the fd legal mount. the fd legal mount is one piece like the stock ones that come with your coilovers

drift937 · 02-11-2012, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wisefab

Hi, my name is loud and clear few posts up. Seriously, i am not here to pick a fight, just trying to point out some things (do not forget, we are illegal in states ....

for now

) Just few pointers are, that whatever we have done, it works really different in racing situations then in the garage. Just try to brake it and you will see things in different light.

Critisize away on our parts, we allways take it in serious consideration and try to learn from it, not to just put it off or fight it.

hey its all good. i think the other guy thought your name was a nick name or something. its not a regular name here in the states. hell my friend from england, i cant even pronounce his last name

conrad_s13.5 · 02-13-2012, 10:44 AM

jesus,...end the pissing match already

welcome Ardo,. im sure we can all share some knowledge.....with a little less attitude

!Zar! · 02-13-2012, 12:26 PM

The pissing match had already ended sir.

JaredP · 02-13-2012, 05:30 PM

i already messaged dan, but im gonna repost here, in hopes that someone may have some input.

I was looking forward to getting the rear knuckle in the future, along with a few other pieces made by pbm but the one part that worries me is the lack of increased negative camber on compression. I do understand that for traction purposes and handling this is for the better but i have some fairly aggressive 18x13 +6 offset wheels with 285/35/18 tires stretched onto them. i have 50mm overfenders that will be bowed out to accomodate and would like to have as little negative camber as possible.

now on to my question, do you think, with the lessened camber decrease on compression, there is a chance that my wheel will strike the overfender and destroy it or should i be ok? those wheels will not be my drift wheels, but even street driving the suspension is bound to compress and id rather not split my overs into 5 pieces just driving around. hopefully i gave enough information to help you guys make an informed guesstimate.

my other option is, since i work at a shop, i can always DD with extra camber on the 13's, and pick up some good looking te's/grids/varrstoens etc. for drifting, and just realign the rear when i want to go drifting to pull some of the camber out..but thats a lot of work if i dont need to. i would LOVE some 70mm overs, but koguchi power are really expensive, and for that money id get a bn blister kit (which has the 70mm overs anyways)

PoorMans180SX · 02-13-2012, 09:56 PM

It's a possibility yes, it really just depends on how your wheels fit now.

It's really easy to figure out. Install all your parts and put them at the settings you would like to run. Jack the rear of the car up and disconnect the coilover on one side. Jack that side up with another jack. See if it hits. Go from there.

JaredP · 02-13-2012, 10:05 PM

thats probably what im going to end up doin poorman. i dont have the rear end in the car as it is right now, im wanting to get subframe risers and all that jazz when i order the knuckles...hence my dilemma. i'll probably end up getting them and making it work. thats the point of big wheels right? make the car fit them

PoorMans180SX · 02-18-2012, 05:26 PM

godrifttoday · 02-18-2012, 07:03 PM

^
Omg ..........

PoorMans180SX · 02-19-2012, 01:35 PM

So I guess these arrive at the end of march...

02-09-2012, 06:00 PM	#3664
!Zar! Post Whore! Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: North Korea Posts: 14,579 Trader Rating: (27) Feedback Score: 27 reviews	Ohh. How much is that? __________________

02-10-2012, 03:19 AM	#3666
Wisefab Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Estonia Posts: 7 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Hi to everybody. I am Ardo from Wisefab and wanted to say, that it's a great forum and we also have been keeping our eye on it to see peoples response to our creations. Thank you all for your comments! I just wanted to point out some things about the PeeBee kit shown in the previous page, that it is by far not the first kit using add-on. We released our BMW kit now a year ago and it uses the add-on. After our kit was released we have seen some other to follow that path aswell. We have upgraded our kit alot now and see alot of problems with the newcomers stuff, that we also struggled with and the last design we are selling now is final and now we are moving on, on the BMW lineup. About our Nissan kit and why we did'nt use the add-on in there. We wanted to push the design, kinematics and lock to the furthest and craziest levels ever seen in drifting. Also the fact that Nissans stock suspension needed alot of correcting to be able to withstand levels we wanted, so we went with the full knuckle design. I guess we pushed the boundaries too far, so our kit is now illegal in few series and closes up the US market for our Nissan kits aswell. Not to worrie, US legal kit is allready in the making and we release it in a month or two. We keep pushing the boundaries in the future in the kinematics and lock aswell. Ardo Wisefab.com __________________ Ready to Lock? www.wisefab.com

02-10-2012, 02:40 PM	#3670
DC Dan MAX USA Zilvia.net Advertiser Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: San Diego Posts: 2,478 Trader Rating: (79) Feedback Score: 79 reviews	That white LCA / tenrod combo, looks like its really easy to bend on dirt drop and flex while driving with the arched tenrod and the length of the unsupported LCA tube. Any track testing or collision experience on that one before it went up for sale? __________________ How To order: You can order directly from our zilvia advertiser threads. When you add to cart, you get an instant shipping estimate, & the cart will remember all of your items as you move between forum threads and our website www.poweredbymax.net until you remove them or check out. I can also calculate estimates manually for you but the cart's estimates are way faster and more accurate. Order Inquiry: IM me your real name and paypal address. Thanks for your business!

02-10-2012, 11:13 PM	#3673
mikerbike Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: SLC, UT Age: 41 Posts: 461 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Finally got around to extending my front control arms and got a front crossmember with the rack mounts moved forward. I haven't had a chance to go brifting yet. I added 1.5". I should have added an inch. Oh well. __________________

02-11-2012, 01:45 PM	#3674
Wisefab Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Estonia Posts: 7 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	We are not sure about the circuitracing stuff, if there is enaugh market for these. For sure our engineer would be more then glad to make them, with his background from all the major circuitracing series all over the world, but there would be no point of making him work for few months for something, we could only sell two kits of. About the white stuff, i am afraid that Dan is right, it can't take a hit. For example on our parts, one guy jumped on to the side of the track on the red-white stones, broke the axle and steering shaft into half, but our stuff was straight and ready to go, so he found the new shaft and axle from the city and qualified for the main event. Also have the "test" done with 100 + km/h wheel straight into the rock test done, slightely bent the arm, but everything else was fine, replaced the arm and ready for racing again. Happy drifting! Ardo __________________ Ready to Lock? www.wisefab.com Last edited by Wisefab; 02-12-2012 at 03:03 AM..

02-09-2012, 05:08 PM	#3662
marks14 Leaky Injector Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Mooresville, NC Age: 32 Posts: 87 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	I like the one piece lca/tension rod, how thick is the mount for the top of the shock? It looks thin from those angles.

02-09-2012, 05:24 PM	#3663
drift937 Leaky Injector Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: ohio Age: 39 Posts: 83 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	1/4" plate with gussets

02-09-2012, 09:19 PM	#3665
Chris28 Zilvia Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: 757/919 Age: 34 Posts: 196 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	So it's basically a FD legal Wisefab kit...I like it. Thinking about making more to sell?

02-11-2012, 02:20 PM	#3675
drift937 Leaky Injector Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: ohio Age: 39 Posts: 83 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	a guy breaking a tie rod on your setup has nothing to do with my setup. i guarantee my work. regardless i could care less who thinks they know what is going on with it. like i said, it will be fine

02-11-2012, 02:51 PM	#3676
Wisefab Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Estonia Posts: 7 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Take it easy man! I am not trying to put you off (hey everybody have done this to us), just to see whats going on and where and how have you tested this. Who has broken a tie rod with our setup? Just say what engineering programs have you used with it and what different forces do you see coming towards it and how much can they withstand and it will be ok. Chill, we are not here to put anybody off, just giving advice. __________________ Ready to Lock? www.wisefab.com

02-11-2012, 03:18 PM	#3677
drift937 Leaky Injector Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: ohio Age: 39 Posts: 83 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	i stress tested them in a 50 ton press with dies at the point i found to be the "weak" points. for them to bend you would have to hit a curb straight on doing like 70 or 80mph. as for engineering programs... the only computer stuff i use is cad to draw up parts to laser cut. engineering is a estimated guess. sitting in the seat and feeling what does what in driving conditions is all the engineering program i need. i am a licensed driver, not a engineer. i wasnt trying to get shitty with you.i actually like your e30 kit and was thinking about it for my own car. i thought you were talking a bout breaking a tie rod but looking back it was an axle. but its whatever.

02-11-2012, 03:47 PM	#3678
GripTerror Zilvia Addict Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Canada Age: 39 Posts: 685 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	hey wisefab dude (whatever your real name ) Would you be interested in seeing interest then in building a setup for a circuit racing/grip oriented type crowd if there was interest?? There are a few forums namely one of them being nissanroadracing, timeattackforums and a few others that build serious track cars that just might bite the bullet on something legit, on nrr, there are a few engineers which will happily criticize your product as well :P One of them is on here Def hehe

02-11-2012, 04:20 PM	#3680
Wisefab Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Estonia Posts: 7 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Hi, my name is loud and clear few posts up. Seriously, i am not here to pick a fight, just trying to point out some things (do not forget, we are illegal in states .... for now) Just few pointers are, that whatever we have done, it works really different in racing situations then in the garage. Just try to brake it and you will see things in different light. Critisize away on our parts, we allways take it in serious consideration and try to learn from it, not to just put it off or fight it. __________________ Ready to Lock? www.wisefab.com

02-11-2012, 04:23 PM	#3681
drift937 Leaky Injector Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: ohio Age: 39 Posts: 83 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	the one pictured is not the fd legal mount. the fd legal mount is one piece like the stock ones that come with your coilovers

02-13-2012, 10:44 AM	#3683
conrad_s13.5 Zilvia FREAK! Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: STL Age: 36 Posts: 1,533 Trader Rating: (6) Feedback Score: 6 reviews	jesus,...end the pissing match already welcome Ardo,. im sure we can all share some knowledge.....with a little less attitude __________________ cONtRol FReAkS

02-13-2012, 12:26 PM	#3684
!Zar! Post Whore! Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: North Korea Posts: 14,579 Trader Rating: (27) Feedback Score: 27 reviews	The pissing match had already ended sir. __________________

02-13-2012, 05:30 PM	#3685
JaredP Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Canada Age: 34 Posts: 443 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	i already messaged dan, but im gonna repost here, in hopes that someone may have some input. I was looking forward to getting the rear knuckle in the future, along with a few other pieces made by pbm but the one part that worries me is the lack of increased negative camber on compression. I do understand that for traction purposes and handling this is for the better but i have some fairly aggressive 18x13 +6 offset wheels with 285/35/18 tires stretched onto them. i have 50mm overfenders that will be bowed out to accomodate and would like to have as little negative camber as possible. now on to my question, do you think, with the lessened camber decrease on compression, there is a chance that my wheel will strike the overfender and destroy it or should i be ok? those wheels will not be my drift wheels, but even street driving the suspension is bound to compress and id rather not split my overs into 5 pieces just driving around. hopefully i gave enough information to help you guys make an informed guesstimate. my other option is, since i work at a shop, i can always DD with extra camber on the 13's, and pick up some good looking te's/grids/varrstoens etc. for drifting, and just realign the rear when i want to go drifting to pull some of the camber out..but thats a lot of work if i dont need to. i would LOVE some 70mm overs, but koguchi power are really expensive, and for that money id get a bn blister kit (which has the 70mm overs anyways)

02-13-2012, 09:56 PM	#3686
PoorMans180SX Zilvia.net Advertiser Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Michigan Age: 36 Posts: 5,574 Trader Rating: (16) Rides Gallery: PoorMans180SX Feedback Score: 16 reviews	It's a possibility yes, it really just depends on how your wheels fit now. It's really easy to figure out. Install all your parts and put them at the settings you would like to run. Jack the rear of the car up and disconnect the coilover on one side. Jack that side up with another jack. See if it hits. Go from there. __________________ Build: http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=643065 Friends don't let friends buy knock-offs.

02-13-2012, 10:05 PM	#3687
JaredP Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Canada Age: 34 Posts: 443 Trader Rating: (5) Feedback Score: 5 reviews	thats probably what im going to end up doin poorman. i dont have the rear end in the car as it is right now, im wanting to get subframe risers and all that jazz when i order the knuckles...hence my dilemma. i'll probably end up getting them and making it work. thats the point of big wheels right? make the car fit them

02-18-2012, 05:26 PM	#3688
PoorMans180SX Zilvia.net Advertiser Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Michigan Age: 36 Posts: 5,574 Trader Rating: (16) Rides Gallery: PoorMans180SX Feedback Score: 16 reviews	__________________ Build: http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=643065 Friends don't let friends buy knock-offs.

02-18-2012, 07:03 PM	#3689
godrifttoday Post Whore! Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: los angeles Age: 40 Posts: 3,120 Trader Rating: (82) Feedback Score: 82 reviews	^ Omg .......... __________________ NEED Bolt kits for your car?

02-19-2012, 01:35 PM	#3690
PoorMans180SX Zilvia.net Advertiser Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Michigan Age: 36 Posts: 5,574 Trader Rating: (16) Rides Gallery: PoorMans180SX Feedback Score: 16 reviews	So I guess these arrive at the end of march... __________________ Build: http://zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=643065 Friends don't let friends buy knock-offs.