This is the roll center, suspension pickup, and steering angle modification thread.

[PoorMans180SX]

Originally Posted by DC Dan MAX USA

Certainly, I posted the update on the last page (39) just before that bomb went off in here.

I feel like that's been happening a lot on Zilvia as of late.

Everyone should stop talking about the degredation of the "scene". As much as it sucks, there's nothing we can do. So let's just keep on keeping on, and eventually, we'll be all that's left.

Back to suspension discussion.

[Slidin' Sam]

Have the D Max Steering Rack spacers been discussed anywhere yet? I haven't seen anything, but they seem legit. Dmax advertises 7-8 degrees of additional angle by using them. I have thought about ordering a set of these off Yahoo Auctions to compliment my PSM knuckles and Ikeya Formula tie rods. Any thoughts?

[Choku_Dorian]

^^u mean the same little spacers everyone makes? or are the dmax different?

I run two sets of the spl's. one between the rod and the rack and one between the inner/outer. gives waaayyy a lot of angle over stock and super cheap.

[S14DB]

Originally Posted by Slidin' Sam

Have the D Max Steering Rack spacers been discussed anywhere yet? I haven't seen anything, but they seem legit. Dmax advertises 7-8 degrees of additional angle by using them. I have thought about ordering a set of these off Yahoo Auctions to compliment my PSM knuckles and Ikeya Formula tie rods. Any thoughts?

Is that only with their Knuckles?

[Slidin' Sam]

No, Dmax makes an adapter that threads into the steering rack like your innter tie rod does. Then you thread your inner tie rod into the spacer. This is also supposed to center the rack since the rack is naturally off-set (IE you have more turning angle to one direction and less to the other from factory, this is supposed to even everything out).

[Slidin' Sam]

http://zilvia.net/f/suspension/31985...ion-links.html

This is a link to a seller on zilvia. It's on the bottom of their listing.

[nieko]

DAN!

is it a set ammount adjusted to the roll center?

or will we be able to ask for more or less adjustment?

any idea when this will be available?

[Slidin' Sam]

Dude, seriously, read like two pages before. He answered those questions!!! They are available now. You can make a request on how much you want, but they will calculate it out for you if you do not understand how everything works.

[Pandapants]

Those dmax thingies don't look like they correct over center.

EDIT: J/k, re read the post

[nieko]

haha relaaaax.

for some reason i thought i read that it wasnt available quite yet.

[!Zar!]

If you have modded knuckles, you don't need to worry about over correcting.

But if you run a really low car with stock knuckles, and those super angle spacers, you will more than likely run into issues with over centering.

[PoorMans180SX]

Originally Posted by Slidin' Sam

No, Dmax makes an adapter that threads into the steering rack like your innter tie rod does. Then you thread your inner tie rod into the spacer. This is also supposed to center the rack since the rack is naturally off-set (IE you have more turning angle to one direction and less to the other from factory, this is supposed to even everything out).

I can't really believe that our racks are uneven. I've never noticed a difference. BTW, stance makes the same sort of system, and they advertise 10*. I don't see how it's any different than the spacer rings everybody else sells. Does the same thing.

Originally Posted by nieko

haha relaaaax.

for some reason i thought i read that it wasnt available quite yet.

Front knuckles = available, you can specify ackerman and RCA.

Rear knuckles = not available yet.

[Slidin' Sam]

Originally Posted by PoorMans180SX

I can't really believe that our racks are uneven. I've never noticed a difference. BTW, stance makes the same sort of system, and they advertise 10*. I don't see how it's any different than the spacer rings everybody else sells. Does the same thing.



Front knuckles = available, you can specify ackerman and RCA.

Rear knuckles = not available yet.

Slip on spacers only add 1-2 (maybe 3-4...can't remember of the top of my head) degrees of angle. The Dmax things add 7-8. I will have to take a look at the Stance deal.

So, turn your steering wheel full counter to the right, and look at it. Now turn your steering wheel full counter to the left and look at it. One side has a little bit more angle. Why is this? Well, the steering input to the rack is pushed over to one side of the car, naturally from the factory. (if you sat in the center of the car, it would be equal on both sides). The Dmax deal is supposed to compensate for this and give you the same amount of angle on each side (so the spacer's would be rh/lh specific, and that would apply to lhd/rhd specific as well).

Mind you, this is all assuming my Japanese is on point enough to understand this thoroughly.

I might try to take some pictures of the steering angle on one of my friends cars (how it has more to one side than the other) and post it up here tomorrow. (my car is torn apart right now or else I would use it as an example).

[RSDogFighters]

^^^ The D Max steering rack adapters are not lh/rh specific.

[SoSideways]

I think Slidin' Sam might be correct.

Then again, none of my stuff was aligned correctly when I did my quick visual test on whether or not my steering wheel was centered or not. It still isn't, but I get the exact amount of turns from left to right, so I am happy.

[Z33dori]

is he talking about these Spacers?

Driftworks GeoMaster - Offset Rack Spacers | Steering | Driftworks

over center correcting spacers. thats what is sounds like. Not the stance outter ends like someone just mentioned.

[Slidin' Sam]

Originally Posted by Z33dori

is he talking about these Spacers?

Driftworks GeoMaster - Offset Rack Spacers | Steering | Driftworks

over center correcting spacers. thats what is sounds like. Not the stance outter ends like someone just mentioned.

No, that's not it.

Yahoo Auctions:
?D-MAX????UP???????? S14?????? - INEX?2???? - Yahoo!??????

D-Max JP web-site:
Â�Ø‚êÅ*p‚t‚oÆ’AÆ’_Æ’vÆ’^Â�[Æ’LÆ’bÆ’g Â�b Æ’GÆ’AÆ’Â�Æ’pÂ�[Æ’c‚È‚çD-MAX‚ÅÂ�FÆ’GÆ’AÆ’Â�Æ’pÂ�[Æ’c

[Z33dori]

ah yes i see now. Very different.

[PoorMans180SX]

Stance Super Angle Kit:

Super Angle Kit

Dan, what do you think the maximum roll center correction you can do is?

[Z33dori]

Originally Posted by PoorMans180SX

Stance Super Angle Kit:

Super Angle Kit

Dan, what do you think the maximum roll center correction you can do is?

oh nvm, i didnt realized it came with the offset spacer, tie rod spacers and the outter ends. That makes more sense why they claim so much angle added on.

seems like a worthy deal for 250. specially since they are bump steer corrected.

[DC Dan MAX USA]

Any amount of front knuckle roll center corretion can be done. Ive seen the range 1 to 4cm being offered in Drift Tengoku but anything over the 2.5cm that we have pictured on Tommys car will require additional labor and materials.

As for the rear knuckle despite claims from another company offering a knuckle that lowers the car 5cm, the actual R/C correction at the hub is limited to about 2.5cm or the axle boot will hit the upswept camber arm. Apart from the rear knuckle, our subframe solid risers provide correction to the rear end as well.

Originally Posted by Choku_Dorian

... the little spacers everyone makes...
I run two sets ... one between the rod and the rack and one between the inner/outer.

that does not make any sense, because the steering angle spacer functions by letting the inner tie rod slip into the rack farther before it hits the back of the inner tie rod ball joint. The connection of the inner and outer tie rod is simply adjusting the overall tie rod length for proper toe alignment.

[PoorMans180SX]

Originally Posted by DC Dan MAX USA

Any amount of front knuckle roll center corretion can be done. Ive seen the range 1 to 4cm being offered in Drift Tengoku but anything over the 2.5cm that we have pictured on Tommys car will require additional labor and materials.

Yeah, I was asking about the front. Thanks for replying. 4cm is pretty cool.

[nieko]

Could we bring our car in for you guys to measure how much is neccesary?

Or where are you guys actually measuring from so there is no confusion lol

[DC Dan MAX USA]

Sure you can schedule the car whenever its convenient for you mon-fri 10:30-5:30
When I state the measurement its on the knuckle itself from where the taper hole mounting surface used to be on the knuckle to where it is after the mod.

[SoSideways]

Originally Posted by PoorMans180SX

You want your arms so that the ball joints are lower than (or at least even with) the inner control arm bolts. That way your car won't gain positive camber during suspension compression.

Be careful with that statement... not everyone can do that because at some point, the lower arm will straight up contact the wheel from too much spacing.

Also, you don't necessarily have to have the ball joint located beneath the inner pivot for the suspension to gain negative camber under compression. As long as the angle between the imaginary line formed by the upper mount and ball joint and the imaginary line formed by the lower arm inner pivot and ball joint do not exceed 90 degrees at maximum, you will still get negative camber gain under compression.

If you have a pillowball upper mount camber plate thing, that means where the spherical bearing is... so if you moved it in for negative camber, that changes the angle of that line a little bit.

[PoorMans180SX]

Originally Posted by SoSideways

Be careful with that statement... not everyone can do that because at some point, the lower arm will straight up contact the wheel from too much spacing.

Also, you don't necessarily have to have the ball joint located beneath the inner pivot for the suspension to gain negative camber under compression. As long as the angle between the imaginary line formed by the upper mount and ball joint and the imaginary line formed by the lower arm inner pivot and ball joint do not exceed 90 degrees at maximum, you will still get negative camber gain under compression.

If you have a pillowball upper mount camber plate thing, that means where the spherical bearing is... so if you moved it in for negative camber, that changes the angle of that line a little bit.

Ahh, you're right, forgot that. I'll delete the post so I'm not spreading misinformation.

[Slidin' Sam]

So any idea's on the D-max angle spacers? Their website say's they use them with their knuckles...for backwards entries...the new mandatory gangsterness, lol!

[PoorMans180SX]

I'm guessing they work.

[Slidin' Sam]

I'm guessing that nobody on here has used them before and therefore nobody can give a real critique. Looks like I will have to test them myself...I will probably wait until September... gotta save for tires and everything for G1GP and Matsuri next month!

[Steve Lloyd]

Originally Posted by PoorMans180SX

Stance Super Angle Kit:

Super Angle Kit

So what makes the S14 kit not work on an S13??