Mosque being built near Ground Zero

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by 5pecialist

Because it's a political agenda being pushed by Mr. Hopey Changey, not the Muslims. Obama is trying to force Islam down our throats, whereas your family is probably busy being peaceful & shit, not trying to convert everyone.

QFT






Oh wait

[Quail]

I'm glad to see level headed people in this thread. A lot of the online media are blowing this way out of proportion. Excuse me for posting one of these articles, and excuse the stereotypical dry British humour, but it does raise some valid points:

Charlie Brooker | 'Ground Zero mosque'? The reality is less provocative | Comment is free | The Guardian

I see no problem with this community center (whatever you want to call it) being built, but is it sensible idea? No. I fear the repercussions. People need to detach the Islamic faith from the few extremist individuals that ruin it for the masses, but most don't seem to be able to.

[5pecialist]

Originally Posted by Quail

People need to detach the Islamic faith from the few extremist individuals that ruin it for the masses, but most don't seem to be able to.

It would help if Islam would publicize this detail, or run a PR campaign. Their apathy does not help regular people to understand.

It also doesn't help that the only time we hear about Islam is when it's negative... such as their attempt to wipe out teaching of the Holocaust.

[Quail]

Originally Posted by 5pecialist

It would help if Islam would publicize this detail, or run a PR campaign. Their apathy does not help regular people to understand.

It also doesn't help that the only time we hear about Islam is when it's negative... such as their attempt to wipe out teaching of the Holocaust.

I totally agree, and most do, but as we know, as far as the media are concerned, bad news is good news (for selling papers and viewing statistics). Reporting on what everybody already agrees with (ie, terrorists are bad) doesn't do them any favours. Every interview I've seen with Islamic spokespeople has always denounced the actions of terrorists. What more can they do if they don't get the airtime? Unfortunately theres no PR department for the Islamic faith!

Originally Posted by 5pecialist

such as their attempt to wipe out teaching of the Holocaust.

Again, the few ruining it for the masses.

[ronmcdon]

What PR Campaign efforts would be recommended?
In all honesty, I think the most they can do is host charity events.
Christian based groups do this.
I don't hear much about Islamic groups doing this
(but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist).

Obviously you can't expect ads in the Superbowl or something like that.

[Quail]

Originally Posted by ronmcdon

What PR Campaign efforts would be recommended?
In all honesty, I think the most they can do is host charity events.
Christian based groups do this.
I don't hear much about Islamic groups doing this
(but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist).

Obviously you can't expect ads in the Superbowl or something like that.

All Muslims are meant to give 2.5% (minimum) of their wealth (monetary, livestock, etc) to Charity each year. I'm not Muslim so I can't say whether most stick to this, but I know its a requirement of the faith. Zakat

[5pecialist]

Originally Posted by ronmcdon

What PR Campaign efforts would be recommended?
In all honesty, I think the most they can do is host charity events.
Christian based groups do this.
I don't hear much about Islamic groups doing this
(but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist).

Obviously you can't expect ads in the Superbowl or something like that.

The Mormons seem to have a lot of ads on television... (not that I condone fake religions).

[BustedS13]

Originally Posted by 5pecialist

The Mormons seem to have a lot of ads on television... (not that I condone fake religions).

the mormons are just as ridiculous as any other denomination of christianity.

[5pecialist]

Originally Posted by BustedS13

the mormons are just as ridiculous as any other denomination of christianity.

No, they are not. Mormonism is a fabricated religion.

What do you have against Christianity?

[BustedS13]

Originally Posted by 5pecialist

No, they are not. Mormonism is a fabricated religion.

What do you have against Christianity?

let me get RIGHT to the point here. which denomination are you?

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by 5pecialist

No, they are not. Mormonism is a fabricated religion.

What do you have against Christianity?

Christianity IS a fabricated religion and the LDS church isn't any crazier than any of the others.

That is my opinion based on actual experience going to MANY different churches.




BustedS13 I would bet money that this guy is a Baptist. That denomination tends to believe that no one is getting into heaven but them and the rest of the world is wrong for not agreeing with them.



Personally I'm more with the Jews with these issues.
First you had these shitty Jews break away from orthodoxy in the name of a false messiah. Then an all around horrible guy comes in from the dessert and tries to co-opt your contract with God.
After that both of these yahoos go around killing your people in the name of YOUR OWN God.

[kingkilburn]

As for the so called "mosque". . .

The media straight up lied about nearly every thing having to do with it.

It's not at, on, or even near the World Trade Center.

It's not a mosque.

Even if it was a mosque, who are you to tell any person what they can and can't do with their property. You can take away the first two points and it still stands.

Worst of all is the xenophobia and overt racism.

Originally Posted by BustedS13

Mormonism was founded relatively recently. that's the only difference.

Not any more recently than any of the American forms of Christianity when compared to the older European and Middle Eastern branches.

[BustedS13]

i really think atheism is going to catch on this century. hot new trend. heatseeker.

[kingkilburn]

I don't know if it will be atheism catching on or people just not caring any more.

Either way +1 for that. We need the rep system back.

[5pecialist]

Denomination?! Go home.

[BustedS13]

Originally Posted by 5pecialist

Denomination?! Go home.

you just made fun of Mormonism, a denomination of Christianity. now, what superior denomination are you?

[5pecialist]

Originally Posted by BustedS13

you just made fun of Mormonism, a denomination of Christianity. now, what superior denomination are you?

Mormons are a make believe religion. Sorry.

[BustedS13]

Originally Posted by 5pecialist

Mormons are a make believe religion. Sorry.

this is the problem with religious arguments. you guys always take your ball and go home.

Is it? I would like to see your Proof on this...

You said your OPINION was based of many types of churches you attend, correct?

But you STATED, Christianity IS a fabricated .. That does not sound like a Opinion...

Please, I am honestly very curious on you input ..

everything we have has come from man. you have no proof that the men who wrote the bible were actually channeling God. it's a lot more believable that they were either batshit crazy or trying to make a buck.

[Drift N Dragg]

Originally Posted by BustedS13

everything we have has come from man. you have no proof that the men who wrote the bible were actually channeling God. it's a lot more believable that they were either batshit crazy or trying to make a buck.

Again, you also have no proof that it wasn't GOD Channeling.

Not everything comes from man.

This is a Issue that can not be won.. Because no one can go back 20,000 Years to find out.

Originally Posted by BustedS13

this is the problem with religious arguments. you guys always take your ball and go home.

Same is said about your Religious Argument.

Seems to me, that it is your point that you want right. So bring the ball back.

[kingkilburn]

I'll start with Jesus.
In Judaism there is a specific list of things the Messiah must be and also must not be. These things are nonnegotiable and set in stone. Jesus of Nazareth did not fit the bill. He is not the only Jew to claim to be the Messiah but he is one of the most far fetched.

Then we have the accounts of his life. They are all very conflicting and written way after the fact. Now I don't doubt the guy lived in that place and time but there is no way any self respecting Jew did much of any of the things that are attributed to him.

It all goes down hill from there. As the Catholics and Orthodox churches moved further away from Judaism they seem to have lost their connection to what is actually in the bible, specifically the old testament.





My opinion on the Morman church comes from years of searching for God myself. I went from church to church and non of it felt right. The best I could find were the Mormans. If you are going to believe that Jesus is your savior that is not a bad group of friends to have. They were all good people to me. I don't agree with some of the things the church leadership does but the people, the heart of the faith , are good.

What moved me out of christianity was my continued search for God. I ended up in a Chabad shul. Their ideas on God and faith, religion in general more aligned with what I was looking for.

After going and discussing many varying things with them I am still not convinced there even is a God.

Now my mind is going all over the place with different thoughts and ideas on the subject. lol
If there are any more specific questions on the subject you have for me you are welcome to ask. You will probably get a better answer that way too.



I know saying things like this are controversial but I'm not saying it to attack any one for what they believe. These are the conclusions I have come up with after trying to look at the facts of Christianity and Judaism scientifically and historically.

[Drift N Dragg]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

I'll start with Jesus.

I have to say this ... Very well put together..

I am doing a Anthropology Report and this thread seems to be a good basis .. But I am impressed with your statement

[kingkilburn]

Thank you.

[ESmorz]

Shut the fuck up. People the whole world over just need to shut the fuck up. Some brohammys wanna build a god damn Muslim Community Center dedicated to
their version of the man in the sky, all the power to them.

Technology and World Circumstances vs. The Progression of Morality and Beliefs... is an amusing and frustrating game to watch from the sidelines.

[kingkilburn]

It's rather hard to prove a negative.

Can you prove there is a magical dragon? Until you can, all available info/data says there isn't.

[BustedS13]

here's a link to donate to the Cordoba Initiative.

Donate | Cordoba

[kingkilburn]

And if you would like one found I can FIND and DOCUMENT it. Math is ABSOLUTELY provable.

Even irrational and imaginary numbers can be proven.

[theicecreamdan]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

And if you would like one found I can FIND and DOCUMENT it. Math is ABSOLUTELY provable.

Even irrational and imaginary numbers can be proven.

"Absolute" is a poor word choice for your argument.
Gödel's incompleteness theorems - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[ineedone]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

And if you would like one found I can FIND and DOCUMENT it. Math is ABSOLUTELY provable.

Even irrational and imaginary numbers can be proven.

Prove how far 0 is from 1.

[kingkilburn]

Given that 0 and 1 are both known quantities and they are exactly 1 whole apart it doesn't mater how many parts you chop the distance between the two into.

They can be 10/10 1/1 7584632/7584632. It doesn't matter.

[ineedone]

Originally Posted by kingkilburn

Given that 0 and 1 are both known quantities and they are exactly 1 whole apart it doesn't mater how many parts you chop the distance between the two into.

They can be 10/10 1/1 7584632/7584632. It doesn't matter.

What is 1 whole part? and what is the quantity of 1?

But it does absolutely matter

Look, I understand what we accept as 0 and 1. I am just merely pointing out that you can not give an "absolute" definition for it. Just like trying to define the word reasonable. It is just impossible.