GT2871 USERS. SR motor

[Black240Ct]

Originally Posted by di-devol

What PSI was that at?

15, maxed at 17 towards the end

[huffandpuff00]

Originally Posted by di-devol

Flywheel came loose, just got it back together ahah. I rescheduled for Friday at 4:30.

I have the best luck ever.

Dang that's scary, good thing you caught it before it was on the dyno. I'll try to leave work early on Friday and come by psi for your pulls

[cotbu]

Originally Posted by Black240Ct

with a s14 sr, greddy easy cams, 2871r on a haltech I made 330 at 16 psi.

going to be retuning with colder plugs and a larger gap on LS coils,

any input on this?

Originally Posted by Black240Ct

graph on a dyno jet.

we did a few quick pulls to verify AFR while we adjusted Dwell time on the LS coils.


the dyno program wasnt reading RPM properly so i couldnt a shot of that graph.
not too sure how accurate these numbers are but the butt dyno feels nice

s14 sr, 2871 .64, greddy cams, 810cc, haltech

Ok, I'll say it! You've made less power and torque, after your upgrades! Which equals not worth it, right??? You're actually making gt28r power!
And your graph kinda looks NA.Dynojet?

[LuckyX2]

Originally Posted by Black240Ct

15, maxed at 17 towards the end

Something must be wrong.

I made same hp and 50 ftlbs more torque than you on an s15 turbo spiking to 17psi and tailing off to 14psi...

I'd give your engine a good lookover because something is not right with either your engine or the dyno.

[codyace]

Originally Posted by LuckyX2

Something must be wrong.

I made same hp and 50 ftlbs more torque than you on an s15 turbo spiking to 17psi and tailing off to 14psi...

I'd give your engine a good lookover because something is not right with either your engine or the dyno.

I'll agree. The graph looks smooth, may even be too conservative of a tune.

[di-devol]

Welp, just got back from the dyno. No matter what we tried it just kept leaning out, hitting 14-16afr under boost. We upped the fuel pressure to 85psi and it still was leaning out to 13-14AFR.

With the pressure at 85psi, the power potential looks really good. It showed 340hp 315tq @19psi @5500 rpms when he had to let off.

EDIT: Trying to figure it out, I jumped to quick : D

[tabasco122]

may end up saying the same thing. i got my ecu back, still lean as hell during idle, WOT is like 13:1 so its a bit lean up there too. not sure what else to try. car is quick on wastegate pressure though, it is set to 8.5 but creeps to 10 around 5k. i owned a new camaro ss convertible last night on the highway.

[Black240Ct]

Originally Posted by cotbu

Ok, I'll say it! You've made less power and torque, after your upgrades! Which equals not worth it, right??? You're actually making gt28r power!
And your graph kinda looks NA.Dynojet?

ahah i agree with you the resulting dyno graph makes it look like i lost about 30 hp, but this is the difference in the two dyno's i went on ( and this most recent graph is a bit sketchy), but driving impressions, the car is noticably faster, revs harder and smoother then before.

the dyno graph i posted, im now realizing after going back to the same dyno with another car is incorrect.

on that dyno jet...if i switch it between MPH and RPM, the graph changed drastically to the point where we have 1500 foot lbs, and HP changes between the graphs.
other times when looking at the HP Tq/ Rpm graph the Rpm signal stops and picks up like 2k later.., or just stops recording after 4k i had no miss fires. this motor is sound and has no issues.

the cable the dyno used for rpm signal was inconsistent and the gear ratio he selected for my 240 diff/ 350z trans was incorrect. they have since ordered a new rpm sensor cable or what ever,

but that graph is crap

i am talking with another dyno in my area on getting time to just do some passes(hopefully for free) and get an RPM vs HP/Tq graph, (or ill take it to the place that originally tuned my car where i made the 330, but thats three hours away)


regardless my afr's were safe during the dyno time so thats a success in by book

[StepN2Boost]

Supp guys. Just about done with my GT2871 upgrade. Will be getting dynoed in a couple weeks. I noticed quite a few of you installing upgraded cams and headgaskets along with your setups. Is it worth it? Im contemplating doing the same. Heres the current mod list:

-stock top and bottom end
-Aem standalone
-Greddy ls-spec fmic
-mr tubular manifold
-mr turbo elbow
-mr downpipe
-mr cat delete
-Blitz Neur-spec exhaust
-spec d clutch kit
-isis thicker radiator w/efans
-batt relocation
-haltech bcs
-hks bov
-vlsd
-walbro 255
-isis fpr
-dw 810cc injectors

[Silverbullet]

Originally Posted by codyace

Sure iridium is nice, but Copper are cheap insurance in the respect that you can erradicate one of them and potentially save a piston (for the stock bottom end crew). Call is a funny 'failsafe' but they do work.

can you elaborate? Are copper plugs more likely to be destroyed from knock?

[LuckyX2]

Originally Posted by StepN2Boost

Supp guys. Just about done with my GT2871 upgrade. Will be getting dynoed in a couple weeks. I noticed quite a few of you installing upgraded cams and headgaskets along with your setups. Is it worth it? Im contemplating doing the same. Heres the current mod list:

-stock top and bottom end
-Aem standalone
-Greddy ls-spec fmic
-mr tubular manifold
-mr turbo elbow
-mr downpipe
-mr cat delete
-Blitz Neur-spec exhaust
-spec d clutch kit
-isis thicker radiator w/efans
-batt relocation
-haltech bcs
-hks bov
-vlsd
-walbro 255
-isis fpr
-dw 810cc injectors

Stock cams are really going to limit the flow for a gt2871.
256-264 duration cams have proven to be a good match for the gt2871 and I suggest you go with that as I'm sure many others would suggest. You'd be looking at an extra 30hp peak or so not to mention a longer, flatter powerband with more area with the right cams.

As for the headgasket, that's more a reliability thing instead of a power upgrade assuming you get the same thickness. A thinner or thicker headgasket will make a slight difference in power tho.

[rps_jrdn]

Originally Posted by LuckyX2

Stock cams are really going to limit the flow for a gt2871.
256-264 duration cams have proven to be a good match for the gt2871 and I suggest you go with that as I'm sure many others would suggest. You'd be looking at an extra 30hp peak or so not to mention a longer, flatter powerband with more area with the right cams.
.

agreed... i'm running 264 bc cams.... with disco potato gt2860rs and made 315whp in calgary alberta where the air is way thinner and less dense due to our high altitude...prior to cams i ran 278whp... though my motor is now a 2.1 liter and fully built... i'm sure the extra dispacement helped in hitting 315 at this altitude with that turbo. cars boosting 15psi. (going back this summer for a 17psi tune to aim for 325-330whp) anything is possible with a great tuner.... i know my buddy had the 2871 and pushed 378whp with hks stage 1 cams and stock motor. just metal head gasket. and fuel mods. running power fc... soooo yeah in conclusion.... get some cams yo! i can post a dyno graph later today if anyone is interested.

[huffandpuff00]

Originally Posted by StepN2Boost

Supp guys. Just about done with my GT2871 upgrade. Will be getting dynoed in a couple weeks. I noticed quite a few of you installing upgraded cams and headgaskets along with your setups. Is it worth it? Im contemplating doing the same. Heres the current mod list:

-stock top and bottom end
-Aem standalone
-Greddy ls-spec fmic
-mr tubular manifold
-mr turbo elbow
-mr downpipe
-mr cat delete
-Blitz Neur-spec exhaust
-spec d clutch kit
-isis thicker radiator w/efans
-batt relocation
-haltech bcs
-hks bov
-vlsd
-walbro 255
-isis fpr
-dw 810cc injectors

I don't think cams and head gasket are necessary. my stock top and bottom end made 330whp and 315trq with GT28RS .86. If you have someone that can properly tune your aem then you should make 330 just fine with your 2871.
What horsepower are you looking to reach?

Zack's 240SX 330WHP - YouTube

[LuckyX2]

Originally Posted by huffandpuff00

I don't think cams and head gasket are necessary. my stock top and bottom end made 330whp and 315trq with GT28RS .86. If you have someone that can properly tune your aem then you should make 330 just fine with your 2871.
What horsepower are you looking to reach?

Zack's 240SX 330WHP - YouTube

Sure you made good numbers on the stock cams but that doesn't mean it wouldn't have been much better with some aftermarket cams.

An engine is an air pump and considering that it's the cams that control how air comes in and out; I'd say they're perhaps the most important part along with the turbo since the turbo is controlling airflow too.

Cams can significantly change the behavior of an engine, moving the powerband up or down, making it longer or shorter (not that you'd ever want it shorter...) and ideally giving more power overall (area under the curve). Even if you only make a little bit more peak hp with a cam upgrade, what's more important is that you're getting more usable power overall.

Edit: I just watched your video. Notice how your torque peaks and then starts a gradual decline now take a look at one of codyace's dynos with S3 cams and see the torque peak and hold. That's the advantage of proper cams, usable, smooth power. Especially with the .86 housing you have, your power should be holding better up top.

[codyace]

The only person I've seen really push the stock cams and make awesome power was 4x4le...he was running an .86 housing setup, as well as big boost and e-85 IIRC though. Either way it's uncommon for sure, but possible.

Would I ever run stockers? No...but that's not to say they can't make power with a capable (4x4le being one) tuner.

[StepN2Boost]

Stock cams are really going to limit the flow for a gt2871.
256-264 duration cams have proven to be a good match for the gt2871 and I suggest you go with that as I'm sure many others would suggest. You'd be looking at an extra 30hp peak or so not to mention a longer, flatter powerband with more area with the right cams.

As for the headgasket, that's more a reliability thing instead of a power upgrade assuming you get the same thickness. A thinner or thicker headgasket will make a slight difference in power tho.

this makes sense. but what do you mean by the headgasket being a reliability thing?

I don't think cams and head gasket are necessary. my stock top and bottom end made 330whp and 315trq with GT28RS .86. If you have someone that can properly tune your aem then you should make 330 just fine with your 2871.
What horsepower are you looking to reach?

Justin daniels from gulfcoast motorworks will be tuning my car, he is certified on the aem website. He is confident that 350-400ish is attainable with my setup. Which from what everyone says and what Ive read, would be an optimistic number to say the least. With that said, guy is either bs me or he knows how to tune like a mfer!

An engine is an air pump and considering that it's the cams that control how air comes in and out; I'd say they're perhaps the most important part along with the turbo since the turbo is controlling airflow too.
Cams can significantly change the behavior of an engine, moving the powerband up or down, making it longer or shorter (not that you'd ever want it shorter...) and ideally giving more power overall (area under the curve). Even if you only make a little bit more peak hp with a cam upgrade, what's more important is that you're getting more usable power overall.

wow, just what I needed to hear to fully understand the relationship between cams and turbo. And the function the cam provides to the engine as a whole.

I'm beginning to realize that horsepower isnt everything.

The only person I've seen really push the stock cams and make awesome power was 4x4le...he was running an .86 housing setup, as well as big boost and e-85 IIRC though. Either way it's uncommon for sure, but possible.

where is 4x4le located? It would be cool if he could chime in so i can pick his brain. lol.

[LuckyX2]

Originally Posted by StepN2Boost

this makes sense. but what do you mean by the headgasket being a reliability thing?

wow, just what I needed to hear to fully understand the relationship between cams and turbo. And the function the cam provides to the engine as a whole.

I'm beginning to realize that horsepower isnt everything.

The stock headgasket isn't really strong enough for a 2871. You'd be at risk for blowing it which is bad, obviously. So by getting an aftermarket one, you won't blow it (not as easily at least) and have a more reliable engine, that's all. It doesn't do much for power.

And think of it this way, cams control how much air to let in and when. You can have a giant turbo pushing tons of air but if you have cams that don't let much air into the engine or let air in at a bad time then what's the point?

[cotbu]

Originally Posted by LuckyX2

The stock headgasket isn't really strong enough for a 2871. You'd be at risk for blowing it which is bad, obviously. So by getting an aftermarket one, you won't blow it (not as easily at least) and have a more reliable engine, that's all. It doesn't do much for power.

And think of it this way, cams control how much air to let in and when. You can have a giant turbo pushing tons of air but if you have cams that don't let much air into the engine or let air in at a bad time then what's the point?

Would it be rude, If i completely disagree with the head gasket comment, and partially disagree with the cam analogy??!

[StepN2Boost]

The stock headgasket isn't really strong enough for a 2871. You'd be at risk for blowing it which is bad, obviously. So by getting an aftermarket one, you won't blow it (not as easily at least) and have a more reliable engine, that's all. It doesn't do much for power.

And think of it this way, cams control how much air to let in and when. You can have a giant turbo pushing tons of air but if you have cams that don't let much air into the engine or let air in at a bad time then what's the point?

Im not a fan of blowing headgaskets, so thats a good enough reason for me to upgrade. I would like to have reliability just as much as power, she is my dd. what size would you suggest? also, good insight on how the cam operates.

[LuckyX2]

Originally Posted by cotbu

Would it be rude, If i completely disagree with the head gasket comment, and partially disagree with the cam analogy??!

Of course not; I'd like to hear your thoughts on it.

[cotbu]

Ok, The head gasket doesn't know what turbo is on the engine, so why would it matter if it's stock or aftermarket?
If I detonate I want my head gasket to go immediately, not stick around until my piston goes or bangs a hole in my block?
I have 400hp stock bottom end, I tune myself and avoiding detonation is the key.
I will be tearing her down for a rebuild in 2013 if she makes it, and installing an aftermarket head gasket at that time.

The cams you, just don't throw huge bump sticks on because you up graded the turbo.
There is a specific cam for each setup that will yeild the best performance. I just think there's more to it than, yeah upgrade the cams. Look at how many people are running BC272 and have whack performance. Not that BC272 suck . they do but it's not an ideal cam for there setup. People are now understanding that the JWTs3 cams are a better choice, but why?(CodyAce?) It's actually the 260-266 duration and 10.5-11.5mm lift has best performance. There are a couple of cams that fall into that category.
I guess i'm not really ready had a looooong day. sorry!

[OutlawLui]

2006? damn this thread is old

[LuckyX2]

Originally Posted by cotbu

Ok, The head gasket doesn't know what turbo is on the engine, so why would it matter if it's stock or aftermarket?
If I detonate I want my head gasket to go immediately, not stick around until my piston goes or bangs a hole in my block?
I have 400hp stock bottom end, I tune myself and avoiding detonation is the key.
I will be tearing her down for a rebuild in 2013 if she makes it, and installing an aftermarket head gasket at that time.

The cams you, just don't throw huge bump sticks on because you up graded the turbo.
There is a specific cam for each setup that will yeild the best performance. I just think there's more to it than, yeah upgrade the cams. Look at how many people are running BC272 and have whack performance. Not that BC272 suck . they do but it's not an ideal cam for there setup. People are now understanding that the JWTs3 cams are a better choice, but why?(CodyAce?) It's actually the 260-266 duration and 10.5-11.5mm lift has best performance. There are a couple of cams that fall into that category.
I guess i'm not really ready had a looooong day. sorry!

I don't see how what you said is in any disagreement with what I've said...

I suggested an aftermarket headgasket "So by getting an aftermarket one, you won't blow it" and you say you'll be putting an aftermarket headgasket on your engine. We're in agreement there.

Also, I never suggested he put big cams on, in fact I suggested what you suggested "if you have cams that don't let much air into the engine or let air in at a bad time then what's the point" meaning he wants cams with a good amount of lift to let air in (10.5-11.5mm like you said) and cams that let air in at a good time that matches the turbo (260-266 for a 2871) just like you said.

I think you ought to go back and re-read what I said because we're both saying the same thing but it seems you misunderstood me.

By the way, I have a 2871, S3 cams and a metal headgasket on my personal SR. So yeah, I obviously agree with what you're saying.

[cotbu]

Maybe... it was that you said it, (stock head gasket) wasn't strong enough for the 2871r. And yeah I probably took the cam analogy out of context.
PS I also said,

I guess i'm not really ready had a looooong day. sorry!

[LuckyX2]

Originally Posted by cotbu

Maybe... it was that you said it, (stock head gasket) wasn't strong enough for the 2871r. And yeah I probably took the cam analogy out of context.
PS I also said,

Well you might get lucky with the stock one and not blow it but it's obvious that an aftermarket metal one is stronger. That's all I was saying; a metal headgasket will not blow as easily as a stock one.

But you had a long day, it's all good!

Originally Posted by StepN2Boost

Im not a fan of blowing headgaskets, so thats a good enough reason for me to upgrade. I would like to have reliability just as much as power, she is my dd. what size would you suggest? also, good insight on how the cam operates.

I'd say go with one the same thickness as stock. Or you can get one a little thicker which will lower your compression slightly thus losing a little power but reducing your risk for detonation. A thinner one will get you some more power but at a heightened risk for detonation which is not ideal since you dd this car.

[cotbu]

lol, and you and my head gasket are around the same age. j/k
I wouldn't call it luck, i would however call it tuned!

[codyace]

Originally Posted by StepN2Boost

Justin daniels from gulfcoast motorworks will be tuning my car, he is certified on the aem website. He is confident that 350-400ish is attainable with my setup. Which from what everyone says and what Ive read, would be an optimistic number to say the least. With that said, guy is either bs me or he knows how to tune like a mfer!

Anyone can make that power. Heck we have a ton of Rom tune cars making power in that range. If your tuner doesn't (and oddly enough many can not) you may as well wash your hands of him.

(warning: rant)

FWIW: (and I've said this 100 times on this thread and on here alone) I have nothing against a custom tune. THE ISSUE however comes into the big X factor; that is, can the 'custom tuner' actually tune? I'd take a 'crappy rom tune' (as forum folklore know nothingness AKA bullshit likes to say) over 95% of the 'custom tunes' out there.

Why? Because at least with the ROM tune (Which means Jim Wolf Technology or RS Enthalpy) you have a proven product that has worked on hundres of cars to good success. Truthfully if a rom tune sucks on a car, 9/10 the car has an overlying issue that makes it suck.

So while I may come off as a fanboy of my stuff, I am that way because it works and works best IMO for most. Since forever ago, people have tried and tried again to come up with setups that outperform my basic little setup, and the truth is they haven't. Custom tuners have emploded engines, or left soft tunes fly off the dyno...parts have broken...stuff isn't right etc etc etc etc. Again, a good tuner with the right parts should have NO issue out doing my setup... but to date the ROM tune setups seem to make more power/torque and have OEM reliability ....why differ on a 350-400 whp street car? These are not 550 whp hot rods here ya know...

Originally Posted by StepN2Boost

where is 4x4le located? It would be cool if he could chime in so i can pick his brain. lol.

Ever think of maybe taking 3 seconds to research his username?

Originally Posted by evilpanamajack

2006? damn this thread is old

And easily the most tech filled thread on here. Thanks for the input (yawn).

[inopsey]

Originally Posted by LuckyX2

Well you might get lucky with the stock one and not blow it but it's obvious that an aftermarket metal one is stronger. That's all I was saying; a metal headgasket will not blow as easily as a stock one.

But you had a long day, it's all good!



I'd say go with one the same thickness as stock. Or you can get one a little thicker which will lower your compression slightly thus losing a little power but reducing your risk for detonation. A thinner one will get you some more power but at a heightened risk for detonation which is not ideal since you dd this car.

i must be one of the lucky few then since ive been running a gt3071 on a stock headgasket now for 3 years always 18+ psi. why do people think nissan engineered a block that can take 400 whp with a headgasket that wont take higher than factory boost?

another dude made a very good point about wanting to head gasket to blow from detonation first instead of the pistons/bottom end.

[inopsey]

Originally Posted by codyace

Anyone can make that power. Heck we have a ton of Rom tune cars making power in that range. If your tuner doesn't (and oddly enough many can not) you may as well wash your hands of him.

(warning: rant)

FWIW: (and I've said this 100 times on this thread and on here alone) I have nothing against a custom tune. THE ISSUE however comes into the big X factor; that is, can the 'custom tuner' actually tune? I'd take a 'crappy rom tune' (as forum folklore know nothingness AKA bullshit likes to say) over 95% of the 'custom tunes' out there.

Why? Because at least with the ROM tune (Which means Jim Wolf Technology or RS Enthalpy) you have a proven product that has worked on hundres of cars to good success. Truthfully if a rom tune sucks on a car, 9/10 the car has an overlying issue that makes it suck.

So while I may come off as a fanboy of my stuff, I am that way because it works and works best IMO for most. Since forever ago, people have tried and tried again to come up with setups that outperform my basic little setup, and the truth is they haven't. Custom tuners have emploded engines, or left soft tunes fly off the dyno...parts have broken...stuff isn't right etc etc etc etc. Again, a good tuner with the right parts should have NO issue out doing my setup... but to date the ROM tune setups seem to make more power/torque and have OEM reliability ....why differ on a 350-400 whp street car? These are not 550 whp hot rods here ya know...



Ever think of maybe taking 3 seconds to research his username?




And easily the most tech filled thread on here. Thanks for the input (yawn).

i have to ask but if you uploaded a jwt map for the turbo setup onto a standalone with the same setup would it not give the same power outupt as a jwt tune removing a crappy tuner from the equation? it would still leaving he ability to tweek the jwt tune cuz of the standalone.

[codyace]

Originally Posted by inopsey

i must be one of the lucky few then since ive been running a gt3071 on a stock headgasket now for 3 years always 18+ psi. why do people think nissan engineered a block that can take 400 whp with a headgasket that wont take higher than factory boost?

another dude made a very good point about wanting to head gasket to blow from detonation first instead of the pistons/bottom end.

Detonation is what kills headgaskets for sure. While I do not think going MLS is a bad idea, I do think that there are times where even the slightest 'aggressive' tune with bad gas can hiccup and cause problems.

With that said for a 350-400 whp car...on a nice tune...I'd probably leave it be if you knew the block was good...however with the age of these things, and the condition, I don't really suggest anyone just throwing the engine in and rolling...but I'm also anal.

Originally Posted by inopsey

i have to ask but if you uploaded a jwt map for the turbo setup onto a standalone with the same setup would it not give the same power outupt as a jwt tune removing a crappy tuner from the equation? it would still leaving he ability to tweek the jwt tune cuz of the standalone.

That would really be the ultimate way to go IMO. Uploading the JWT or Enthalpy setup onto your own Nistune/Similar and then editing it would be great. THe issue that allows though are people (not you, but in general) who then sell the 'tunes' without really doing anything. This was a HUGE issue with the Calum based ECU's as people would essentially share the JWT tunes, and edit their own setup...which doesn't help Calum or Clark in regard to proper income.

With that said (as above) I see no issue though buying a JWT tune, and then editing it after purchasing a tuneable setup to edit it.