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Old 01-21-2008, 09:10 PM   #151
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Not every welding machine has a foot control. I agree with you as far as welding small parts but try welding a 30" stainless pipe without moving the torch. I like tig welding but if Im welding a bunch of stuff I would just whip out the mig gun.

O. I was referring to the tig welding process. All tig welders have either a foot pedal amperage control, or an aftermarket torch mounted ampertrol. I have both.
Also you shouldn't mig weld stainless. It will become brittle.
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Old 01-21-2008, 09:16 PM   #152
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O. I was referring to the tig welding process.
Also you shouldn't mig weld stainless. It will become brittle.
I was refering to tig as well I just meant if I was going to be welding a bunch of crap I would rather mig weld it rather then take all day tigging it. Ive built/welded several things MIG welding stainless, not sure why you think it would be brittle. One thing I learned working in the field (construction) is using a flux core stainless wire with a shielding gas works great.
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Old 01-21-2008, 09:22 PM   #153
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If you are welding on any stainless it could theoretically be possible to properly mig weld stainless if you were using stainless wire, and back purged the tubing being welded.

I was not aware that anyone made flux core stainless mig wire, or why you would want to use flux core on stainless due to the terrible appearance of a flux core weld.
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Old 01-21-2008, 09:28 PM   #154
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If you are welding on any stainless it could theoretically be possible to properly mig weld stainless if you were using stainless wire, and back purged the tubing being welded.

I was not aware that anyone made flux core stainless mig wire, or why you would want to use flux core on stainless due to the terrible appearance of a flux core weld.
Welds dont have to look pretty but you are right it looks like seagull shit. I actually hadnt seen any stainless flux core until last year. The gas and flux do a pretty good job of shielding the weld from any sugaring.
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Old 01-21-2008, 09:49 PM   #155
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Well shit. I will have to check that out. But for most of my customers the welds have to look very nice in order to pass approval.
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Old 01-21-2008, 10:23 PM   #156
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what kind of tubing bender do you use im in the market for one and im not sure what to get

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I just finished this one the other day. There's a lot of my other projects on my site if anyone is interested. But I suck at remembering to take pictures a lot of the time, so there's some stuff missing.
http://www.theoryinpracticeengineeri...llery/main.php











And the rest of the pics are here:
http://www.theoryinpracticeengineering.com/gallery/syn/

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Old 01-22-2008, 03:56 PM   #157
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Im not sure what he uses but I have looked before and I would go with this. Probably the best bang for your buck. You build it yourself but you buy the prints. I think its like $17 for the prints and the materials all depend on how frugal you are.

http://www.gottrikes.com/

Its hard to beat what some companies offer on prebent roll cages though. But if you are like me you would probably want to make your own anyway.
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Old 01-22-2008, 03:59 PM   #158
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Well shit. I will have to check that out. But for most of my customers the welds have to look very nice in order to pass approval.
Have you ever used Solarflux? Cheap alternative to purging.
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Old 01-22-2008, 04:18 PM   #159
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I'm using the JD2 Model 3 bender. I did a bunch of research and talked to a bunch of people and it seemed like it was the best bet for the money. I think total it was around $700 for the bender, a die set, the floor mount pedastal, handle, degree ring, bend-tech software and something else I'm probably forgetting. It was worth it and it can be upgraded to pneumatic/hydraulic down the road. I haven't felt the need for that other than it that was done it could be made mobile rather than fixed to the floor. But once you get the hang of it, it makes things so much easier.

And the bending software was a nice touch. Measuring and figuring out where to start bends isn't hard, it just takes longer than plugging in numbers and having something else do it for you. And for what I paid for the software, I made back in the amount of time I saved. And it lets me save all my different templates so I can call them up again later.

And for prebent stuff, from what I've seen, the fitment isn't that great. For what you'll save, you'll spend more time messing with it and trying to get things to line up. I mean you can make them work, but it's not the quality that I would want. But buying a bender can be expensive if you aren't going to use it much.

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Old 01-22-2008, 09:58 PM   #160
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I just bought a JD2 model 3 today with the 1-3/4 die set, the total came out to 564.00 shipped to my shop, They are on a 1-2week back order, I hope it actually shows up, i bought from a random internet supplier. I opted for no stand, and no handle. i have a scrap yard a block from the shop where i can get the materials to build both for 10$. It does come with a Degree ring for the price i paid.

I will probably buy the software later down the road once i'm doing more cars then 240's, i have already done a few so i dont really need it yet.

where do you guys buy your tubing from? I have a great steel manufacture that is about 20mins away, i would hate to have to order it from a chassis shop or a wholesaler. i was getting material quotes around 5-6$ per foot through those types of places i just cant see paying that when i want to buy 100-500 feet at a time.
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Old 01-22-2008, 10:47 PM   #161
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I get steel from a local place around me. What size and material were they quoting $5-6/ft for? I could see smaller places trying to sell 4130 for that, but for mild steel that's about twice what I pay for 1.75x0.095 or 1.75x0.120.
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Old 01-23-2008, 06:23 AM   #162
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Call AED motorsports in Indy (www.aedmotorsports.com). The people who work there are awesome and have everything you could need as far as tubing goes.

Tim,
that cage looks awesome! I've wondered how that software is and have been wanting to buy it. Can you model manifolds on it?
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Old 01-23-2008, 10:08 AM   #163
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Thanks Bill. The version of the software I'm using is the base stuff. So it's all 2d. 3d bends I figure out using a lot of math, but I finally think I figured it out so I can get the weird bends exactly where I want them. So this version wouldn't be the best for manifolds. But they do have a couple other versions that could work, but I don't have any experience with them, so I don't want to say one way or another. Although there was one guy on here who designed a manifold in Solidworks or Inventor and it seemed like it made some things easier for him. It was the guy doing the RB in the E30 or BMW something. Just another idea.

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Old 01-23-2008, 04:13 PM   #164
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Out of curiosity, how many people are welders by trade here? And I don't mean people who just know how weld. I mean people who actually weld everyday for a living?
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Old 01-23-2008, 04:17 PM   #165
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Out of curiosity, how many people are welders by trade here? And I don't mean people who just know how weld. I mean people who actually weld everyday for a living?
I am, been doing it for the past 6 months of my life (since i got back from NC) im pretty good MIG, training in Tig, im already graduated SS and Mild Steel, i'm working on my aluminum skilzzzzz
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Old 01-23-2008, 08:21 PM   #166
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I weld everyday at work. It depends on what im doing but usually about 1/3 of my day is tig welding.
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Old 01-23-2008, 08:57 PM   #167
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ehhhhh this is like my third time welding and the welds came out like crap cuz there was some paint left over but w/e then i decided to make a tub for the first time ever.. well it came out a bit big and the fiberglass was a bitch. also first time fiberglassing too. but hey gotta start somewhere.








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Old 01-23-2008, 09:02 PM   #168
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Good attempt. I would reconsider cutting and welding to that extent until you can produce something acceptable on some scrap metal.

Not trying to make you feel bad, just saying it was a good attempt with poor execution.

Also what did you fiberglass?
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Old 01-23-2008, 09:30 PM   #169
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when i started i was like hmmm absolutely no clue whats going on right now but im going to make the attempt by other pics and stuff ive seen on the forums so far. if you look at the bottom pic thats fiber glass i will never use the cloth again from now on matt only or that bondo glass stuff
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Old 01-23-2008, 09:46 PM   #170
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well at least you broke the ice for me.
im not a good welder at all, but heres my stich welds and spot welds.





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Old 01-23-2008, 10:12 PM   #171
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Just so you and everyone knows.

Some tips on sheet metal welding:

Sheet metal warps when welded on continuously. Solution: Make small welds or tacks every inch or so. Also dont weld in a line. Weld in one spot then go to another area and weld. Spread it out as much as possible.

Tips on welding in general:
The cleanness of the area to be welded will determine how well the weld turns out. You should make cleaning a step in the welding process. Also consider it a prerequisite before welding is even possible to have the cleanest metal possible. I think of it like this. If the metal can be cleaner, it will be before the welder is turned on.

Also some tips on joining 2 pieces together.

The only thing besides what i just said above.

Fit Fit Fit Fit Fit. This goes for aluminum, stainless, inc, ti, cromo, steel.
The closer the fit the better the end result. Easier to weld, cleaner welds, smaller beads, more even welds. I have had customers think the welds I am showing them are a machine weld, due to gapless fitment.
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Old 01-24-2008, 02:41 AM   #172
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^ good info. I got a millermatic 140 using .24 wire recently and looking to stitch weld the chassis. Do you have any tips on that? Is it just tack welds between the stock tack welds or should I make once inch beads? Which part of the vehicle are the must do areas in stitch welding?

Another question: For prep, is it okay to use a flap disk or should I use a wire wheel.
How thick is the metal on the chassis?
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Old 01-24-2008, 02:46 AM   #173
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Not to be a downer but that most likely qualifies your car as totaled.
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Old 01-24-2008, 05:24 AM   #174
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Not to be a downer but that most likely qualifies your car as totaled.
Pobably not totalled just needing to be refined.

If your welding skills suck ass and you want to make a fiber tub, I would go ahead and measure everything out and then make tubs out of cardboard to make sure everything fits and is up to par with the cardboard models.

Then go and get some foam or other mold making materials and make a plug. Then make yourself a female mold from the plug. Then use them both to make a compression mold and make some fiber tubs.

To mount them in, you could use resin and cloth to mold it all in but I would go with something like a small piece of sheet metal on all of the joining areas and attach it with some hex heads or something that way when you fuck it all up you can remove it and repace it.

I have seen this approach here in Japan on a couple of cars, results vary widely. I am a big fan of sheet metal tubs but fiber ones can be functional and look good if done right.

I am working on a Fiber dash mold right now and will hopefully post up my results soon. I am working on busting the vinyl down slightly right now in order to build a smooth surface to work with.

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Old 01-24-2008, 06:24 AM   #175
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thanks guys, i kinda had no clue what i was doing but ive been going through cursedgtr's s15 build and gavsters s14 build and a couple others. should i just cut mine back out? and go with a different approach or what or will i be able to fix it with a bit more fiberglass. i have thin sheet metal under neath it but the cut didnt come out to good and it was a bit off so i fiberglassed overit and was going to try smoothening everything out to try and make it look clean but im also going ka-t with a gt35r turbo i believe so i dont know if any piping will be in the way or what? please help me!!! haha
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Old 01-24-2008, 07:24 AM   #176
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^ good info. I got a millermatic 140 using .24 wire recently and looking to stitch weld the chassis. Do you have any tips on that? Is it just tack welds between the stock tack welds or should I make once inch beads? Which part of the vehicle are the must do areas in stitch welding?

Another question: For prep, is it okay to use a flap disk or should I use a wire wheel.
How thick is the metal on the chassis?
I'm also extremely interested in what you guys have to say about this, because I'll be doing the same (with the same welder/wire) on my S14 soon.

Luke, Tim, Jon - you guys are awesome for keeping this thread going
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Old 01-24-2008, 08:23 AM   #177
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I just stitched mine, and I don't think I could have done it without a flap wheel.
Whoever invented those things should be nominated for a nobel prize.

One tip, keep a knotted wire wheel for removing seam sealer and a worn out flap wheel for paint removal.
I say worn out because I'm finishing out a spool of flux core and keep a lot of 80 and 60 grit flap wheels around for cleaning up my ugly welds and removing the grip of slag/spatter that fuckscore leaves behind. So I have a lot of worn out 60 grit flapwheels, and they're great.
They're still abrasive enough to cut through paint like nothing, but not like a new flapwheel where you can gouge sheetmetal pretty badly if you catch the corner of the disc on something.
But a knotted wire wheel is the best thing I've found so far for removing seam sealer. Also, wear goggles and make sure the inside of the car is free of anything you think you could boner up with an errant spark.
I rarely wear goggles, but am going to start after getting a piece of gooey, hot, melted seam sealer on my eyelid.

It also sucks when you do the engine bay before stripping the interior out and start a fire on the interior side of the firewall when stitching the back side of the wheelwell. The asphalt crap on the floor burns like hell and smells awful.

Oh yeah, and cover your windows with a wet towel if you are welding right next to it. Spatter pits glass and once it's pitted, it's a pain in the ass to clean for the rest of time because your paper towel hang ups and gets all shredded and stuff.
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Old 01-24-2008, 10:11 AM   #178
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Originally Posted by blu808 View Post
Just so you and everyone knows.

Some tips on sheet metal welding:

Sheet metal warps when welded on continuously. Solution: Make small welds or tacks every inch or so. Also dont weld in a line. Weld in one spot then go to another area and weld. Spread it out as much as possible.

Tips on welding in general:
The cleanness of the area to be welded will determine how well the weld turns out. You should make cleaning a step in the welding process. Also consider it a prerequisite before welding is even possible to have the cleanest metal possible. I think of it like this. If the metal can be cleaner, it will be before the welder is turned on.

Also some tips on joining 2 pieces together.

The only thing besides what i just said above.

Fit Fit Fit Fit Fit. This goes for aluminum, stainless, inc, ti, cromo, steel.
The closer the fit the better the end result. Easier to weld, cleaner welds, smaller beads, more even welds. I have had customers think the welds I am showing them are a machine weld, due to gapless fitment.
Yay! Someone knowledgeable with good info! lol.
I couldn't have said it better.
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Old 01-24-2008, 10:46 AM   #179
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when doing seam welding, keep it in a ventilated area, keep water around, fires can and do happen sometimes. I use a variation of tools, Long handled gasket scrapper, knotted wire wheel,Flap disks, Rol-Loc wheels with Scotchbrite wheels, and sanding disk wheels. Propane torch,WD40.

ill post some pictures of the latest car we are doing a chassis down build of.

Jon
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Old 01-24-2008, 04:27 PM   #180
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Out of curiosity, how many people are welders by trade here? And I don't mean people who just know how weld. I mean people who actually weld everyday for a living?
Union Pipewelder. Been Welding for about 7 years.
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