V8 240sx FAQ

[240heaven]

luke free up your pm box!!!

[blu808]

Whats up Mike? Hows the chassi coming along. Anyways, i know that there isnt a clearance problem on the s14 cars. I am waiting to see what the case will be with the hinson s13 kit, since your kit was modified from the s14 unit.
I know brian has the hood clearance issue in the works, and im sure he will have it resolved.

Also for the front sway bar, all you need is to get some block aluminum and space the mounts down about an inch.

Originally Posted by mikespeed95

wow, lot of information in this thread....also a lot of misinfo, and things that reallllllllllly make me wonder.

anyways, peopel wanting a ls1 swap, check out http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=28

heres some bulid up threads on s chassis on there right now

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=565461

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=564082

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=565336

has anyone actually completed a hinson s13 yet luke with the hood closing, or hte front swaybar clearing the oil pan?? my blower is only 3'' taller than the stock manifold, and it stuck 4.5'' out the top of the hood

j30 rear swaybar can solve problems with exhaust clearance. my ls13 is running dual 3'' exhausts,and sounds like nascar. however i personally on my ls13 arent running any swaybars right now, since i cant get a front one that will clear the oil pan.

for the money, a ls1 stock will throw down about 330rwhp with the mods required to put it in a s chassis. you can get a motor for between 2500-4k if you get off your butt and actually call around, and look. i paid 3500 for my complete motorset, with only 30k miles on it out of an 02 ss camaro.

[g6civcx]

Originally Posted by g6civcx

Can you comment on the wiring? Will the vendor be providing support to mate the engine to the chassis?

Why did somebody give me negative reps for this post? Luke specifically asked for questions in the opening post.

[blu808]

Donno man. But thats kinda gay that someone would leave neg rep just for making that post.

[Neejay]

Originally Posted by g6civcx

Why did somebody give me negative reps for this post? Luke specifically asked for questions in the opening post.

Bleh, yeah that sucks.

[shinrekka]

i want ford 302 power

[ledzeppelin240]

i want ford 302 power

I could not justify using a ford 302 when the LS1 is far more superior, I mean shit, anything worth doing is worth doing right!!!

[mikespeed95]

Originally Posted by blu808

Whats up Mike? Hows the chassi coming along. Anyways, i know that there isnt a clearance problem on the s14 cars. I am waiting to see what the case will be with the hinson s13 kit, since your kit was modified from the s14 unit.
I know brian has the hood clearance issue in the works, and im sure he will have it resolved.

Also for the front sway bar, all you need is to get some block aluminum and space the mounts down about an inch.

if he is working on it why do i have people aim'ing , emailing me askign me if it will fit becaus ethey are thinking about buying it and i have to tell them i dont know after they tell me its the same for 13/14??

lol

[ranger2339]

Because they love you mike...



Ax

[marshun]

im hooked. i want an ls1. hopefully i can find one for sale here in hawaii. then into the s13 it goes.

[shinrekka]

Originally Posted by ledzeppelin240

I could not justify using a ford 302 when the LS1 is far more superior, I mean shit, anything worth doing is worth doing right!!!

Because using a ford 302, would be thousands less then an LS1. I'd much rather put in a reliable ford 302, then another KA. Not everyone has thousands of dollars to spend on an engine. Hence the reason im goin CA. Or if someone come out for a kit to put a 302 in a S13. I'd do that.

I recall reading on this forums somewere that someone was coming out with a kit to put in the 302. It was supposed to be the economy option to the LS1 swap. I dont know what ever happened to that. .

I mean I know alot of people have money and have a goal for alot of power. My goal, is to have a reliable 240sx to drive. One that will start everyday and get me to where i have to go. The KA failed miserably, twice. The CA will alow me to have a reliable car thats a bit faster then a stock 240, hopefully. However if a 302 swap kit came out, i would have alot more power then a stock 240 and still have a reliable car.

[haveblue]

as much fun as we in the import community make fun of the 'stone age' tech of pushrods, there is a lot to be said for ford and chevy v8s, because the bang for the buck is very high. I know next to nothing about either one but I thought I would throw this out there for discussion:
http://www.mustangandfords.com/techarticles/28898/
looks like a 302 has as much potential as an ls1 for those who aren't building 9 sec cars.

I will say a custom hybrid car will never be as reliable as a stock oem car. if you want reliability get a civic and call it a day. If you wana fast/fun sports car you gota pay to play.

[ledzeppelin240]

looks like a 302 has as much potential as an ls1 for those who aren't building 9 sec cars.

Yeah it is a very capable engine, I am not bashing that. A LS1 can be had for about $2500CND, but if you want the T56, complete wiring that is going to bring it up to $3500-$4000. The LS1 comes with 350hp plus and that is stock, 400hp is easily had for cheap if you know what your doing.

The Ford engine is heavy and only 5spd(not sure what tranny options there are??)but is cheap and can put down some good numbers. The LS1 has the T56 tranny option and is quite a bit lighter, but more expensive. An either one of them will have plenty of power for a 2600lb car...

[shinrekka]

I can garuntee many people would buy the ford v8 kit just becuase the overall cost would affordable. Yes the 302 only comes 5speed, but theres nothing wrong with that. 80s 300zx's come with the exact same tranny.

[mikespeed95]

[QUOTE=shinrekka]Because using a ford 302, would be thousands less then an LS1. I'd much rather put in a reliable ford 302, then another KA. Not everyone has thousands of dollars to spend on an engine. Hence the reason im goin CA. Or if someone come out for a kit to put a 302 in a S13. I'd do that. [quote]

the only thing that makes a 302 look reliable comparatively in the v8 community is called opti spark.

I recall reading on this forums somewere that someone was coming out with a kit to put in the 302. It was supposed to be the economy option to the LS1 swap. I dont know what ever happened to that. .

dont compare a 302 to a ls1 again. the block on the 302 cant take as much power as a ka's block, the oiling system is less than spectacular, the block is open deck IIRC, its just yuck yuck yuck. trannys suck, just stay away.

I mean I know alot of people have money and have a goal for alot of power.

what car enthusiast doesn't?

My goal, is to have a reliable 240sx to drive.

then dont start modding it, especially wtih a 302.

One that will start everyday and get me to where i have to go. The KA failed miserably, twice. The CA will alow me to have a reliable car thats a bit faster then a stock 240, hopefully. However if a 302 swap kit came out, i would have alot more power then a stock 240 and still have a reliable car.

you think th enissan engine is unreliable...yet you want a 86-95 ford motor? please.

i want to slap everyone who just said the t5 that is mated to the 5.0 isnt a bad tranny. have yall ever actually shifted it? eww

my cummins turbo diesel tranny feels better

another chep v8 that doesnt suck....q45 with Z tranny. search for ellis autoworkz car

[SicBastard]

Did nissan ever even put a manual behind one of their v8s?

[ledzeppelin240]

Uh huh...mikespeed95 is on the same level that I am on. The 302 to me sounds like a terrible idea in so many ways. The LS1 is not the 'God" of engines, but is arguably one of the best small block V8's...

I would rather swap in a completly stock LS1, be able to run low 12's and out run cars that cost 4 times as much as mine. All this with basically a stock driveterrain(besides the driveshaft and a LSD is a must), then get 28mpg when ever I decide to drive the car to work. I am a avid fan of technology and electronics, the spark timing, fuel injection, and ignition timing is so percise it is ridicoulous with todays modern engines. Imagine what a big block would do if it had all the technology that even a 2000+ Civic has in it, that engine would rock...

[datboibrad]

its funny to me that people still go back to the MPG associated with ls1 f and c bodies. lets not forget the rear end gearing is ALOT lower than the 4.08 240 stock gearing. just something you may want to think about before getting into and finding out the truth. dont take this the wrong way as ls1 bashing, im doing the swap myself its just something i noticed when i sat down and thought about it.

[ranger240]

some sites with good info on VH45DE swaps
site mikespeed95 metioned:
http://www.ellisautoworkz.com/cars/450sx.asp
and
a 240z owner that outlines the process of mating a t-56 to the VH45DE
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/563982

its a ton of work.. notching frames ect... not to mention the whole intake mani poping outta the hood.. check out the ellis video though, it sure sounds mean

anyone else have any good info, links, or opinions about the swap?

maybe this sticky v8 faq could be devided into engine-specific threads
i dunno if admins could do that but itd definately help organize all this info

[SicBastard]

So the answer is no. There isn't even an available adapter/bell housing to mate a manual trans to a nissan v8.

LS1 is king, just accept it.

[blu808]

Check this place out. a 1000hp small block that is daily drivable and comes with a warranty.
http://www.nelsonracingengines.com/

[shinrekka]

[QUOTE=mikespeed95][QUOTE=shinrekka]Because using a ford 302, would be thousands less then an LS1. I'd much rather put in a reliable ford 302, then another KA. Not everyone has thousands of dollars to spend on an engine. Hence the reason im goin CA. Or if someone come out for a kit to put a 302 in a S13. I'd do that.

the only thing that makes a 302 look reliable comparatively in the v8 community is called opti spark.



dont compare a 302 to a ls1 again. the block on the 302 cant take as much power as a ka's block, the oiling system is less than spectacular, the block is open deck IIRC, its just yuck yuck yuck. trannys suck, just stay away.



what car enthusiast doesn't?



then dont start modding it, especially wtih a 302.



you think th enissan engine is unreliable...yet you want a 86-95 ford motor? please.

i want to slap everyone who just said the t5 that is mated to the 5.0 isnt a bad tranny. have yall ever actually shifted it? eww

my cummins turbo diesel tranny feels better

another chep v8 that doesnt suck....q45 with Z tranny. search for ellis autoworkz car

I had a mustang 5.0 for 2 years. the MOTOR never ever gave me a problem. It was the rest of the car that sucked. Tranny felt fine, little hard to shift but it wasnt hyrdrolic. The motor is reliable. Very reliable. KA's are not. Try getting 300hp out of a ka without the turbo. And for only a grand to work with, and still maintaing reliability.

And im a car enthusiast that have a dream to be able to drive the car i love, have ample power, and no i dont have alot of money.

It would cost a little more to just out right buy a LSI camaro.

[ThatGuy]

Originally Posted by shinrekka

The motor is reliable. Very reliable. KA's are not. Try getting 300hp out of a ka without the turbo. And for only a grand to work with, and still maintaing reliability.

How many 4 cylinders can you make 300hp, without a turbo, for $1000, and have it be reliable? Your argument against the KA just crumbled. Try again.

[ledzeppelin240]

its funny to me that people still go back to the MPG associated with ls1 f and c bodies

I believe I heard 28mpg from somewhere on the net from the RX-7 guys or something???It was just a number I was throwing out there...This has become a Ford vs. Chev, the facts are there there but some people just keep passing them by....LSx owns Ford 302's.

Wow Nelson Racing has some serious stuff on thier site, friggin awesome. 4cyl engines are great, don't get me wrong, but when you have a power stroke every 180 degrees there is a limit. Compared to a V8 where you have a power stroke every 90 degrees and twice the amount of cyl. to make power with.

It's not just what engine is put in a car. I believe (as well as thousands of others) that it is all about overall balance of the driveterrain, suspension, the dynamics of the car, etc..That is where the LS1 comes out on top no doubt...

[shinrekka]

Im not saying anything bad about the LS series of engines. Its just that its expensive, very expensive. Not only that, then you have to buy the mount kit. And like I said, not everyone has that kind of money. I sure as hell dont have that kind of money to put into a car. If i did, i'd save a little more and buy a wrx. What ford 302's offer that the LSx series motors dont, is overall cheapness. Once the LSx series motors come down in price it would be a reasonable swap for "the rest of us". Im gonna take a hit just rebuilding and swapping in a CA and leaving it stock. Instead of swapping in a SR, why not swap in a 5.0 motor? It would be alot cheaper, more HP and a SHITLOAD more torque, thats were the V8 swap would come in handy. The gain in torque alone would be worth it. I understand and completly agree the LSx series motors are a much better platform, so im not trying to bash chevy or anything. I mean sure, if the LSx series had the same mounts as an old 350, i wouldnt of even posted in the first place. I did read on a post that the swap kit for the LS series engine, and an economy version for the 302 were coming out. I havnt heard of it since, and am incredibly disapointed.

As for MPG of the LSx series engine. My friend has a 06 GTO and it averages 15mpg on a easy day. Before that he had a 99 Z28 that averaged 20mph or so on the highway. Its a high displacement V8, its gonna get bad gas milage.

As for the Q45 motor, its a great motor an all, and i know its been done before. But its daul overhead cam. Which means it takes up alot more room. People have mated it to a Z32 tranny, but thats a whole nother bag of worms.

[shinrekka]

Originally Posted by ThatGuy

How many 4 cylinders can you make 300hp, without a turbo, for $1000, and have it be reliable? Your argument against the KA just crumbled. Try again.

ummm yeh thats not what i was saying, the answer is no, you cant get 300hp out of a KA allmotor, people are still saying its impossible to get 200hp to the wheels out of a KA. Even tho i think rebello racing makes them with damn near close to 300hp (to the crank). For the cost it would take, to get the KA to 300hp RELIABLY, you'd need to turbo it, do internals for reliability, spend money on feul upgrades, tuning, ect. For much much less u can have a all motor 302, no turbo, no nothing, just stupid bolt ons and a cam. I havnt had reliability problems with 302's (88+ w/ MAF). My friend has a mustang as well and does donuts well past redline untill all the belts fly off the engine (yes he's a moron) and he does it all the time. Never done a tune up, only had 1 problem in the last 4 years, distributer cap was shot (orig. cap too). Yes mustangs are absolutly terrible cars, but the motors are great. Takes too much work/money get get 300hp out of a KA. To much shit to deal with, tuning, boost leaks ect.

The 302's a solid platform for someone on a budget.

And u ask WHY do i say KA's suck? It takes to much money to get any kind of power out of it. And it dosent help that i've had several KA's leave me stranded and actually fail a semester of school. Many of my friends ka's have had to be replaced as well. I suppose there ok, i know the new "cool thing" is KA pride but i couldnt care less. Im never taking that route again. Theres so many better options out there. And i know its also cool to say "ford sucks" and having the bragging right to say i have "LS1" in my car.


Same reason alot of people swap in SR20's and not RB26 engines, money is a big factor.

[CKAMC]

shinrekka: regarding your remark about the MPG you need to consider this as well. A 240 weights around 2600~2700lbs with a motor while a GTO weights about 3,725~3,800.... So what happens when you put in a big motor into a lighter car? Better gas mileage because you dont have to put your foot down as much to achive certian ranges in both power and speed compared to pushing a heavier car.

Most of the people IMO who want to do a V8 into a 240 will likely shot high with the idea of an LSx motor... kinda defeats the idea of having a lightweight car by throwing in an engine thats heavier than the stock one that came in it.

KA is just another option and I like it due to the fact it requires a lot of dedication and time but when done correctly it works great. what makes it the "cool thing" is the fact that you have to understand a lot to be able to pull it off and everything you gain and learn from it.

ohh yeah rb26 is just too much thats why we hop onto the rb25 even the rb20 route

[ledzeppelin240]

If you want real hp and tq you have to pay, thats just the way it is. Personally $3500-$4500 for a LS1, T56 tranny, all accesories, and everything required for it to run is not that bad at all.

But anyways how are the current LS1 swaps coming along???

[IDriveFords]

I know for a fact that the block in the 97-98' Mustang Cobras was an all aluminum block because I own one. It's a 4.6 liter modular motor and its insanely easy to work on. Not sure the cost of just the motor (mines still in my car). It's got a T-45 5speed tranny thats not very large. It looks like you could easily stuff that motor and tranny into a 240. I need to check the weight of the motor but I know its not very heavy becuz its an all alum block. My Cobra made 278hp and 278tq sitting at stock but this is not typical (mine is a factory freak). I personally wouldn't be able to afford this swap but it would be very interesting to see. This motor is very very popular amongst mustang owners because it is one of the best designed NA motors ever as far as reliability, workability, and mods are concerned. The 2005 Falken drift mustang actually has this motor in place of the stock 5.0 motor due to weight issues. This motor also seems to respond nicely to boost. I read an article about a twin turbo 97' cobra that was pushing upwards of 900 horse with a twin turbo setup and a nice buildup. I'm pretty sure you can order this motor through Ford racing, but I'm not sure of price. I know they do make a 5.0 liter "cammer" thats a 450 horse N/A motor and that one runs about 10g's. Another considerable swap would be the 03-04' Cobra motors but these are a bit bulkier and would probably throw off the weight dist. Just a thought. If anyone has the exact weight of the 97'-98' 4.6 liter cobra motors please chime in.

[S14DB]

The old 4v motors cannot handle 900 rwhp on the stock internals, MAYBE 450. The 03/04 motors can handle 600 safely. 03/04 are around $9k or so blower to pan complete. 96-01 4v's are $3-4k complete used.

The problem is that those motors are wide as a bus. Never fit between the strut towers.