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Old 06-06-2012, 10:18 PM   #181
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e85 is garbage compared to proprietary solvent 200 proof mixed with toulene.(sp)

and its only about a dollar more a gallon, and twice as good. But most people cant buy it in large quantities without some sort of back ground check.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:25 AM   #182
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Cool story bro.

But this thread is about fuel you can easily get at any pump, that wont need a background check, nor a specific storage area or a specific fuelling system.
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Old 06-07-2012, 03:11 AM   #183
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I been using E85 for three years and it is the reason why my bone stock sr20det with the exception of cams and an oil pan makes (and turbo and fuel obviously) 455.89 rwhp with no issues for 2+ years. (1 year with built motor where my new oil pump turned out defective, I just went back to stock.)

I have 2 walbro fuel pumps, 850 cc injectors, stock, rail stock lines (although I had to replace them recently for other stock lines.) T3/T04r 57 trim turbo set to 20.6 psi of boost, a good road tune (runs a bit rich after 7000 rpms) And other obvious support mods, but E85 related wise, all that was necessary were bigger injectors and an extra fuel pump (I leaned out on one walbro).

The hardest part of the conversion is the tune, parts wise it is stupid simple to convert.


Also when you are tuning for E85 most sensors assume you are running gas. So you do not have to convert the ratios in your head between E85 and Gas. If you are running an actual 10:1 ratio the O2 sensor will read 15:1 ratio (or close to this.) If your sensor is reading 11.5-11.7 to 1 I am actually running somewhere around 7.5 to 1.

Also in 110 degree weather in phoenix my coolant temperature is 165 Fahrenheit, even if I give it a few 450+ whp blasts. 150 in mild winter.

The only drawbacks is that you have to shut off the fuel pump to the car off first, before turning off ignition when parking it. If you do not unburned E85 will seat on the combustion chamber, and if left over night it will slowly seep through the piston rings and contaminate your oil ruining it. I check my oil for consistency before each time I run it. I use 5-40w Diesel oil synthetic from Mobil 1 as this is what works best for the car in my 3+ years.

And this has been my E85 experience with a stock long block sr20det. And after I get a few things ironed out (suspension, transmission), I am hoping to turn output up to 500 rwhp, as I stand I am less then 45 hp away from this.

Looking at Santos dyno, (I had a load based dyno vs inertia type) I believe there is room for me to get more power by advancing timing even more. Hmm.
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Old 06-07-2012, 05:11 AM   #184
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Ive never had to deal with turning pumps off prior to ignition. The oil should be warm enough to vape off any e85 in the oil, if not right away surely on the next startup. Water condensates as engines cool down and gets in the oil but evoperates upon warm up as well.
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Old 06-07-2012, 07:18 AM   #185
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Draw back IMO with e85 is the harder cold starts other then that I loved it in my Evo and live it in my SR
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Old 06-07-2012, 07:57 AM   #186
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Originally Posted by S@nt0s View Post
Draw back IMO with e85 is the harder cold starts other then that I loved it in my Evo and live it in my SR
Related fact: some (all?) flex fuel vehicles come with a little reservoir for gasoline used in cold starts.

And is there any way people know of to help this issue? More or less of timing or fuel when cranking?
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Old 06-07-2012, 10:23 AM   #187
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Related fact: some (all?) flex fuel vehicles come with a little reservoir for gasoline used in cold starts.

And is there any way people know of to help this issue? More or less of timing or fuel when cranking?
Little more trouble then it's worth to have a start up tank.
I have my timin advanced and fuel is bumped up too still playing with the cold start on the SR the Evo needed 3-4 crank attempts an started up
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Old 06-08-2012, 03:18 AM   #188
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Related fact: some (all?) flex fuel vehicles come with a little reservoir for gasoline used in cold starts.

And is there any way people know of to help this issue? More or less of timing or fuel when cranking?
Not much to do i am afraid.
I found out that cranking a second or two, then stopping, then cranking again starts the car easily. It starts faster than keeping on cranking.
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Old 06-08-2012, 07:08 AM   #189
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Not much to do i am afraid.
I found out that cranking a second or two, then stopping, then cranking again starts the car easily. It starts faster than keeping on cranking.
I did a google search for "E85 cold start" and came across quite a few people having success with it.

This guy here: E85 Cold Start Issues addressed. - Subaru Impreza WRX STI Forums: IWSTI.com was able to get it to cold start reliably with 3% more fuel at 68F, 30% more at -40F and linear in between. This would be on top of the already 20-30% more E85 map I believe.
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Old 06-08-2012, 07:17 AM   #190
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I did a google search for "E85 cold start" and came across quite a few people having success with it.

This guy here: E85 Cold Start Issues addressed. - Subaru Impreza WRX STI Forums: IWSTI.com was able to get it to cold start reliably with 3% more fuel at 68F, 30% more at -40F and linear in between. This would be on top of the already 20-30% more E85 map I believe.
every set up will vary because the characteristics of the motor compression, motor is tight or loose etc. just have to play with it i havent given it any time really just a 1 time guess mark and it takes me 1-2mins to crank her up but i start her up every 2-3 days lol
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Old 06-08-2012, 07:33 AM   #191
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every set up will vary because the characteristics of the motor compression, motor is tight or loose etc. just have to play with it i havent given it any time really just a 1 time guess mark and it takes me 1-2mins to crank her up but i start her up every 2-3 days lol
Agreed. I was basically just trying to say that it's gonna take a lot more fuel at start up and that it is possible to get E85 to start up well in the cold. It's definitely going to vary from motor to motor tho.
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Old 06-08-2012, 07:56 AM   #192
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Ya once dialed in its fine I took 2-3 cranks with the Evo cold starts and that was in the winter
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Old 06-08-2012, 08:00 AM   #193
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Ya once dialed in its fine I took 2-3 cranks with the Evo cold starts and that was in the winter
My SR doesn't even do that on gas lol.

Probably my crappy injectors. I have some ID1000's on the way for when I'm going E85 tho. 10:1 compression ceramic coated JE pistons, GTX2867/EFR6758 and a healthy serving of E85 is gonna make for one hell of a car. So excited...
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Old 06-08-2012, 08:29 AM   #194
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My SR doesn't even do that on gas lol.

Probably my crappy injectors. I have some ID1000's on the way for when I'm going E85 tho. 10:1 compression ceramic coated JE pistons, GTX2867/EFR6758 and a healthy serving of E85 is gonna make for one hell of a car. So excited...

I had rc1000 and she started right up. The sr has 1680's my next block will be 11:1 I didn't do it this time because I already had the pistons
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Old 06-08-2012, 08:40 AM   #195
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I had rc1000 and she started right up. The sr has 1680's my next block will be 11:1 I didn't do it this time because I already had the pistons
1680's, damn haha. 11:1 would be awesome too. Not too many people around here do higher compression but with E85 it makes lots of sense. 11:1 is what I wanted to do but only Wiseco has that in an off the shelf part. I have heard of some bad experiences with Wiseco so I went with JE. Highest they have available is 10:1 and I didn't have the time (or the money really) to wait on a custom 11:1 piston from JE.
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Old 06-08-2012, 08:56 AM   #196
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We have ran wiseco and arias for a long time.
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Old 06-08-2012, 09:01 AM   #197
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Perhaps it's more on their motorcycle pistons then? Or maybe just unluckiness?

It was an older motorcycle mechanic who's been in the business for years that cautioned me against Wiseco. Said he's seen a lot of them seize if I remember correctly.
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Old 06-08-2012, 09:13 AM   #198
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Never had a issue in fact wiseco is what's in my sr right now
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Old 06-08-2012, 12:11 PM   #199
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Okay. My question is, do I have to change the stock runner line or anything like that to run E85?

For the dual map, can I run the car til the other gas is like super super low and just fill it with E85?

Anyone in SoCal know a good E85 tuner?


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Old 06-08-2012, 12:20 PM   #200
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Okay. My question is, do I have to change the stock runner line or anything like that to run E85?

For the dual map, can I run the car til the other gas is like super super low and just fill it with E85?

Anyone in SoCal know a good E85 tuner?


Sunny D.-
Unless you're going for ridiculous power, the stock lines are fine. And yeah, that's a fine way of doing it but the "perfect" way would be to wire in a flex fuel sensor and have an adaptive trim setup based on that. I'll just be going with the run it dry and fill up with the other fuel method haha.
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Old 06-08-2012, 12:23 PM   #201
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Okay. My question is, do I have to change the stock runner line or anything like that to run E85?

For the dual map, can I run the car til the other gas is like super super low and just fill it with E85?

Anyone in SoCal know a good E85 tuner?


Sunny D.-
How much power you want push? Return line can be use but will limit you. I found at 470whp I was pushing it passed its max at 16psi on my 6266. This is with a -8 feed. I would tell you to change the return as its the same amount of work and will only take you a few mins longer since you can route and connect both at the same time.
I did make 560whp on stock lines but that was with c16

Dual map you can run the 91 as low as possible like 40miles once your low light comes on then change over to the e85 map then once half way fill again with e85.
I'll tell you this much I was always on e85 and only went to my 91 map as a back up for emergencies.

Hit up Reggie at OSR in Fontana he tuned mine tell him I sent ya
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Old 06-08-2012, 06:23 PM   #202
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^^^^
What size line are you using for your return line ?? Do you think that the -8 feed lines are plenty or do you think that you will go larger in the future if you start making more power. I am looking at making over 700hp and I am trying to decide between -10 or -8 feed and a -6 return.

Thanks
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Old 06-08-2012, 06:53 PM   #203
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I'll go 10 if it calls for it but I think I'm fine with my 8 there and back. When I go double pumper I'll bump my feed.
I'm only at 65% duty cycle n base pressure is at 45 psi
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Old 06-08-2012, 08:05 PM   #204
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Oh I mean rubber hose. Stocks are okay?


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Old 06-08-2012, 08:25 PM   #205
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Oh I mean rubber hose. Stocks are okay?


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I haven't heard of people having issues with the stock rubber. Just be prepared to change out your fuel filter since E85 is going to clean up a lot of gunk in the tank/lines.
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Old 06-09-2012, 12:29 AM   #206
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Cool sounds good. Thanks


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Old 06-11-2012, 12:39 AM   #207
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Perhaps it's more on their motorcycle pistons then? Or maybe just unluckiness?

It was an older motorcycle mechanic who's been in the business for years that cautioned me against Wiseco. Said he's seen a lot of them seize if I remember correctly.
Of course he has seen a lot of them seize ... because they were nearly the only ones sold !

A piston is a piston, it seizes when it is not adjusted properly to the block, when the oil squiters are removed, and/or when the tune is wrong, wether they are named wiseco, CP and all.
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Old 06-11-2012, 02:25 AM   #208
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recently setup this fuel system for E85

fuel system consist of

POWERTUNE twin pump fuel kit
this is design to mount 2 walbro 500 hp fuel pumps
as u can see the top of the billet mounting bracket is design so that each pump can have its own fuel line





POWERTUNE top feed twin entry rail kit using I.D 2000cc injectors and TURBOSMART fuel reg





all the standard fuel lines are replaced with aeroflow fuel lines
each fuel pump runs its own fuel line into each end of the fuel rail
return line is taken from the center of the rail
2 fuel feed lines
1 fuel return line


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Old 06-11-2012, 06:43 AM   #209
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Of course he has seen a lot of them seize ... because they were nearly the only ones sold !

A piston is a piston, it seizes when it is not adjusted properly to the block, when the oil squiters are removed, and/or when the tune is wrong, wether they are named wiseco, CP and all.
It's possible that one manufacturer will seize more than another if their documentation is not good. Some pistons expand more than others depending on what they are made of. One piston might need 0.004" clearance but if the documentation is incorrect and says 0.003" then you're at a higher risk of seizing. Perhaps the Wiseco's expand more than other pistons on average and thus are more sensitive to proper clearances?

I'm just guessing here, all I know is that a well respected mechanic who has been around for years and worked for my dad for 8 of those suggested that I stay away from Wiseco. Besides, I was able to get the JE's for not much more than the Wiseco's


STR8E180, that looks like one badass fuel setup there! You'll never be struggling for fuel with that...

Semi off-topic: I had a dream last night that I was filling up with E85 for the first time lol. I really need to lay off this car stuff...
It was $1.81 in my dream and smelled like a sweet menthol/spearmint haha, I wish that was the case! I have heard that E85 can have a bit of a sweet smell to it tho. Maybe that's where my mind came up with the smell seeing how I've never smelled it in person yet.
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Old 06-12-2012, 04:07 AM   #210
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It's possible that one manufacturer will seize more than another if their documentation is not good. Some pistons expand more than others depending on what they are made of. One piston might need 0.004" clearance but if the documentation is incorrect and says 0.003" then you're at a higher risk of seizing. Perhaps the Wiseco's expand more than other pistons on average and thus are more sensitive to proper clearances?

I'm just guessing here, all I know is that a well respected mechanic who has been around for years and worked for my dad for 8 of those suggested that I stay away from Wiseco. Besides, I was able to get the JE's for not much more than the Wiseco's


STR8E180, that looks like one badass fuel setup there! You'll never be struggling for fuel with that...

Semi off-topic: I had a dream last night that I was filling up with E85 for the first time lol. I really need to lay off this car stuff...
It was $1.81 in my dream and smelled like a sweet menthol/spearmint haha, I wish that was the case! I have heard that E85 can have a bit of a sweet smell to it tho. Maybe that's where my mind came up with the smell seeing how I've never smelled it in person yet.
I know a lot of old tuners saying how fuel injection is crap and how carbs are better. Is it ? Of course not. Old, "respected mechanics" often fail at evolving, they have great knowledge on things that became useless and will just say the techs or tools they dont know are shit. Everyone does that actually. People also tend to reject their faults on something else, and it is way easier to accuse a distant piston maker than question your own abilities, or your friends machining job. That is how you get that kind of nonsense from "experienced people". The less you know, the more you are prone to believing them.

Same goes for most of horror stories... the truth is simple, as long as an item sells a lot, it will also fail a lot more than its competitor in volume, but %failure will still be the same.

Wiseco makes good pistons, same can be told from CP and most piston makers.
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