General politics discussion. Keep it civil.

[kingkilburn]

[KA24DESOneThree]

Originally Posted by feito

leftists on a car forum focused on high power gasoline engines. Oh the irony. Hey mods, can we get an EV forum section for all of them? I got a real bad feeling about this presidency and ICE. Not good for our hobby and passion, at all....

You're thinking micro, when climate change is macro.

Bulk carriers put out appx 440mm metric tons of CO2/year. Container ships put out 140mm metric tons of CO2/year.

My truck, if driven the US average of 13,500 miles, puts out 5.25 metric tons of CO2/year using the number of 243g/km given by the manufacturer in Australia.

Bulk carriers put out appx 83.8 million times my truck's emissions, and container ships put out 26.6 million times my trucks' emissions. There are approximately 273.6 million cars in the United States.

The total output of all the cars in the US, assuming the average is equal to that of my diesel Colorado, is equal to 10.29 container ships or 3.26 bulk carriers.

So, I guess, our cars are pretty small potatoes in the overall scheme of things. The reason why they're a hill politicians are willing to die on is multitudinous, but it's easier to blame cars and force emissions regulations or widespread sale of electric cars than it is to better our transportation infrastructure or revamp cities to better work without cars while increasing population density without increasing crime and decreasing quality of life.

This is not taking into account the human cost of particulate emissions and noxious gases, by the way- its only purpose is to point out how myopic your view is.

TL;DR: Just because Reddit told you PLTR is where the tendies are doesn't mean you've done your due diligence.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree

The total output of all the cars in the US, assuming the average is equal to that of my diesel Colorado, is equal to 10.29 container ships or 3.26 bulk carriers.



So, I guess, our cars are pretty small potatoes in the overall scheme of things. The reason why they're a hill politicians are willing to die on is multitudinous, but it's easier to blame cars and force emissions regulations or widespread sale of electric cars than it is to better our transportation infrastructure or revamp cities to better work without cars while increasing population density without increasing crime and decreasing quality of life.

Goes on rant finally acknowledging cars are not the source of "global climate change" but then goes back to focusing on eliminating cars as the solution.

For fuck sake.

World's largest 12 container ships make more pollution then all the cars in the world.

Eliminate 12 fucking container ships we'll have an immediate positive global impact - unlike mass transit systems or electric cars which are only moving the problem put of sight.

Going electric just means further expanding modern global slavery, enriching despots and dictator and off shoring our pollution.

So again, - you acknowledge global shipping is an issue, but then apposed the only guy in 40 years to do fuck about out sourcing labor and production to the modern slave fields of China and trying to reduce the amount of shipping bringing garbage into the US.

Hey Killbum, if you were a freeman up in New York in 1850, would you wear a cotton shirt made by a slave down in Alabama?

If you were a free German in 1943, would buy a gold watch stolen from a dead jew?

So why you rocking those Nike's?

Meanwhile, the virtue signaling twats are hard at it again....

https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/31/busin...rnd/index.html

[Corbic]

https://youtu.be/5e_LrAILInk


Good work Team Biden. Screw over those dirty Native Americans, Blue Collar Americans and the Unions.

[kingkilburn]

What do you mean "finally"? Personal cars have always been the pollution scapegoat. Here in the Central Valley our air quality issues are entirely based on dumbass industrial ag practices the farmers refuse to move on from, just like the water issues.


P.S.
I have never worn nikes. Nice racism though.

[ixfxi]

president killburn is double bagging and double masking folks

[Future240]

It is amazing how political the pipeline has become.

I spent some time trying to find out if it is a good or bad thing, and honestly it is hard to tell with the spin from sources on it.

Against it
https://www.nrdc.org/stories/what-keystone-pipeline


Appearing to be non bias

Old source appears unbias but info is outdated, intereesting though it brought up Texas property rights. That is something I had not seen before. Some parts of the pipeline would require people to give up their property
https://stateimpact.npr.org/texas/ta...e-xl-pipeline/

Some Texans oppose the pipeline. One of them is farmer Julia Trigg Crawford. After Crawford declined to sign an agreement with the company, they used eminent domain to gain access to her land. She responded by filing a temporary restraining order.

Regarding the jobs this article suggest most of the jobs would be temporary and after its construction there would be 35-50 permanent jobs to maintain the pipeline
https://www.statesman.com/story/news...ck/6673822002/

"When combined with additional 2021 contracts to be announced later, the total number of American union workers constructing Keystone XL in 2021 will exceed 8,000 and $900 million in gross wages," the release said. "In total, Keystone XL is expected to employ more than 11,000 Americans in 2021, creating more than $1.6 billion in gross wages."

That’s close to what the State Department found in its 2014 report.

In the report, the agency wrote that 10,400 estimated positions would be for seasonal construction work lasting four to eight-month periods. Since the State Department defines "job" as "one position that is filled for 1 year," that would equate to approximately 3,900 jobs over a two-year period.

In short: Most of the estimated jobs were temporary.

The State Department forecasted that no more than 50 jobs, some of which could be located in Canada, would be required to maintain the pipeline. Thirty-five of them would be permanent, while 15 would be temporary contractors.

For the pipeline, though noted using data from the the Keystone xl website
https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/...ne-xl-pipeline

According to the Keystone XL website, the project, initially proposed more than a decade ago, would sustain about 11,000 U.S. jobs in 2021 – including 8,000 union jobs – and generate $1.6 billion in gross wages.

For it
Another one, saying how biden is hurting unions as people had jobs lined up that he killed
https://redstate.com/jenniferoo/2021...lation-n314357


Interesting article that shows people who are both for and against it
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-55816229

I have spent quite some time reading on this. My conclusion is there is no perfect answer.

Conservatives love to scream jobs jobs jobs, but ignore the fact that it affects farmers and their land rights too. Not to many native american land, the potential for pollution (not climate) is a real concern for people. Especially when the pipe inevitable leaks.

Lefties love to scream climate despite the fact it is report the pipeline would not have that great of an impact on climate. lefties also ignore the fact that if even temporary tends of thousands of people are now out of work. a job for a year or two is still a job.

My personal opinion after researching on it. I think we should build it.

However, perhaps we can try an reroute it a bit, to reduce the amount of land that has to be taken from farmers or greatly compensate them if that cannot be done. Meetings should be held with the native americans who have concerns about their land and special teams put in place to put extra care and maintenance in those particular sections of the pipe line which could lead to more job increases for the needed security.

[Future240]

Lulz

I remember when conservative news was defending hydroxy and no one had a word to say when Trump still caught the shit.

https://www.readfrontier.org/stories...xychloroquine/

The state purchased the hydroxychloroquine stockpile in early April, days after Trump began to tout it as a treatment. While many acknowledged at the time that reports of the drug’s effectiveness were purely anecdotal, Trump said at a briefing in March, “What do we have to lose? I feel very good about it.”

Health officials nationwide immediately began to caution people against using the drug, throwing water on the idea that it could cure a coronavirus infection and cautioning that it could have serious side effects, including irregular heart rhythms and even the possibility of death. The drug was ultimately discredited as a treatment option and the National Institute of Health released a report in November that the drug had “no clinical benefit to hospitalized patients

[Future240]

https://www.vice.com/en/article/y3ge...spiracy-theory

This is one of those articles I instantly raised an eyebrow to as it is vice, however, upon reading it, they literally have the tweets embedded. Her only defense was "it was my team". Sure, sure, classic shaggy defense.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by Future240

Lulz

I remember when conservative news was defending hydroxy and no one had a word to say when Trump still caught the shit.

https://www.readfrontier.org/stories...xychloroquine/

Not sure what the problem is. NYC was stockpiling CPAPs...

Trump got Covid and was back to work in like 3 days.


Should have reiterated thr fact that this is a bullshit pandemic. +70 year old unhealthy overweight dude with high stress job gets covid, recovers just fine.

In other news, Biden has already killed 23,000 Americans as I post this. Clearly he doesn't care about all the Americans his administration has killed.

https://freebeacon.com/coronavirus/b...death-tracker/

[kingkilburn]

Guy gets given expensive and dangerous therapy usually reserved for those at risk of sudden death anyway. His recovery is entirely down to the amount of money and attention afforded by the presidency.

But you know that and you're just being an asshole about it. Trump lost months ago, we're talking about current events now.

[Future240]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Not sure what the problem is. NYC was stockpiling CPAPs...

Trump got Covid and was back to work in like 3 days.


Should have reiterated thr fact that this is a bullshit pandemic. +70 year old unhealthy overweight dude with high stress job gets covid, recovers just fine.

In other news, Biden has already killed 23,000 Americans as I post this. Clearly he doesn't care about all the Americans his administration has killed.

https://freebeacon.com/coronavirus/b...death-tracker/

Hm one of those does not match the other. Thanks to the "bullshit" pandemic, my spouse just lost a very close family member last week who was in her 40's to covid.

Correction:

Covid has kill 23k Americans.

Biden has inherited Trump's handling of it good or bad. The same amount of people would have died in the last few days regardless of who is in office.

What matters is what actions he takes to curb it.
such as
https://www.npr.org/sections/preside...19-vaccine-dos

However, a president has only so much power.
https://missoulacurrent.com/business...covid-vaccine/

But yes big bad biden cares nothing for these people just because they died while he was in office.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by Future240

Hm one of those does not match the other. Thanks to the "bullshit" pandemic, my spouse just lost a very close family member last week who was in her 40's to covid.



Correction:



Covid has kill 23k Americans.



Biden has inherited Trump's handling of it good or bad. The same amount of people would have died in the last few days regardless of who is in office.



What matters is what actions he takes to curb it.

such as

https://www.npr.org/sections/preside...19-vaccine-dos



However, a president has only so much power.

https://missoulacurrent.com/business...covid-vaccine/



But yes big bad biden cares nothing for these people just because they died while he was in office.

Better go double mask then, make sure you are 2x safe.

[kingkilburn]

It's actually more like 4 to 8 times safe if they both fit well.

[deolio]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

dude has to live at home

Don't most people live at their home?

Originally Posted by Corbic

Goes on rant finally acknowledging cars are not the source of "global climate change" but then goes back to focusing on eliminating cars as the solution.

Just because it's not the largest problem doesn't mean it can't be improved...

Originally Posted by Corbic

Meanwhile, the virtue signaling twats are hard at it again....

https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/31/busin...rnd/index.html

Read the title and instantly thought I opened an Onion article. Coconut water tastes like gooch sweat anyway, good riddance.

[KA24DESOneThree]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Goes on rant finally acknowledging cars are not the source of "global climate change" but then goes back to focusing on eliminating cars as the solution.

For fuck sake.

World's largest 12 container ships make more pollution then all the cars in the world.

Eliminate 12 fucking container ships we'll have an immediate positive global impact - unlike mass transit systems or electric cars which are only moving the problem put of sight.

Going electric just means further expanding modern global slavery, enriching despots and dictator and off shoring our pollution.

So again, - you acknowledge global shipping is an issue, but then apposed the only guy in 40 years to do fuck about out sourcing labor and production to the modern slave fields of China and trying to reduce the amount of shipping bringing garbage into the US.

Car's aren't the solution to climate change, but cars are a problem. You're, frankly, a buffoon if you refuse to believe that vehicle particulate emissions aren't a problem. No one on here puts 30k mi/yr on their 400whp, decatted, SR'd car- and I'm a proponent of losing 10whp to run a cat anyway. My track car, whenever I finish it, will have a cat.

I know you're all about the American Dream TM, but we talked about this before and you danced around the points I made. If we can move people closer to their jobs while increasing their quality of life, why wouldn't we? Instead of sitting in their cars in traffic, they could be walking with their children. Instead of inner-city kids growing up with developmental problems and asthma, they could be growing up with parents who have more disposable income (which would decrease the number of children going without food, which increases the number of children who progress in school rather than having cognitive and behavioral issues) while breathing cleaner air.

Do you think that because I think Trump was an ignorant, pig-headed ass, I'm automatically opposed to literally everything he did? No, I'm opposed to everything he did because it wasn't fully fleshed-out.

Tariffs are regressive, have always been regressive, and as such always hit the poor and middle-class the hardest.

Manufacturing sector growth needed to be targeted- it wasn't. Cars? Farm equipment? Defense manufacturing? We need to move consumer goods back here without increasing cost- no small feat given that we're competing with an economic superpower that has better backing for small manufacturers, has incredibly low raw materials cost due to subsidization and lack of environmental concerns, and subsidizes shipping to the point it's almost free. AI and automation are eating manufacturing jobs, so even if we do move manufacturing home, we're never going to see the same workforce participation we once did... again shifting the momentum toward a service economy.

Yes, battery tech is still in its infancy and yes, lithium mining is environmentally catastrophic. However, some of the biggest potential mines in the world are in Australia (which housed 60% of the lithium production in 2018), Canada, and the United States- with fairly robust environmental safety systems in place. I know there's a European lithium concern that will be mining in Europe, with rapid and efficient transportation pipelines to European manufacturing. Speaking of despots and dictators, that's xenophobia writ large- Chile is one of the most stable democracies in South America, and Argentina is also a democratic constitutional republic that has been stamping out corruption actively and quickly.

[Future240]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Better go double mask then, make sure you are 2x safe.

What a riveting counter point.

[ixfxi]

Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree

Yes, battery tech is still in its infancy and yes, lithium mining is environmentally catastrophic. However, some of the biggest potential mines in the world are in Australia (which housed 60% of the lithium production in 2018), Canada, and the United States- with fairly robust environmental safety systems in place. I know there's a European lithium concern that will be mining in Europe, with rapid and efficient transportation pipelines to European manufacturing. Speaking of despots and dictators, that's xenophobia writ large- Chile is one of the most stable democracies in South America, and Argentina is also a democratic constitutional republic that has been stamping out corruption actively and quickly.

you speak like an economist, always tossing out figures. put aside the mining, you switch people over to increased load on the electrical system which is already overwhelmed and now we're pushing for more nuclear. you can wipe your ass with wind and solar, the shit just doesnt cut the mustard

smaller more efficient cars/engines, thats the solution. but people refuse to compromise. this is one of the reason people are attracted like moths to the flame with tesla, you get great performance with no immediately visible compromise. they dont know OR care where the power comes from, or where the pollution goes as long as its not in plain sight. just like overseas manufacturing, give us our goods and fuck the slaves who have to manufacture it.

so yes, the tariffs made sense if you're trying to bring back work and manufacturing here.

[ixfxi]

Originally Posted by deolio

Don't most people live at their home?

oh quit being a cock sucker, you know what i meant.

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

oh quit being a cock sucker, you know what i meant.

No, Explain the whole comment for us. Spell it out.

[brndck]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

and now we're pushing for more nuclear. you can wipe your ass with wind and solar, the shit just doesnt cut the mustard
.

more nuclear would be fantastic. Even the most recent nuclear facility in the US (Vogtle unit 3 began construction in 2012) was designed a over a decade ago. Most nukes in the US were designed before I was born (with few exceptions like Diablo Canyon and San-O).

Newer thorium based fuels shit allllllll over uranium based fuels, and will even see great benefit in molten salt reactors.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by brndck

more nuclear would be fantastic. Even the most recent nuclear facility in the US (Vogtle unit 3 began construction in 2012) was designed a over a decade ago. Most nukes in the US were designed before I was born (with few exceptions like Diablo Canyon and San-O).



Newer thorium based fuels shit allllllll over uranium based fuels, and will even see great benefit in molten salt reactors.

Except the Eco-Terrorists will never allow it. Watch to Many Godzilla movies they have. I'm sure HBO's Chrynobel did nothing to help.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree

Yeah, we've beaten this to death.

To summarize:

You want to legislate away free choice and force us into distopian megacities so we are completely trapped and 100% reliant on the government/corporations for housing, transportation, healthcare and work.

You believe this because:

Single Family Homes are to expensive
Single Family Homes are wasteful (energy and space)
Single Family Homes are to spread out making mass transit impossible, thus encourage private vehicle ownership.
Suburbs are Racist and Evil

You are also one of those crying about the corporations, corrupt politicians , etc.

Yet - you now want to trap people in massive high rises with no hope of ever escaping their landlords and neighbors. You want to strip them of private transportation ensuring their lives shrink to a 3 block radius or they are forever on someone else's schedule. You want to ensure wages and opportunities are eliminated, since once you can't leave, you become a defacto Serf - aka Land Slave. All the while expanding the power and control of the Political and Corporate classes that will run these megacities.

It's ironic because you claim "how can people live" highlighting the failures of the west coast. I post up examples of how to make a living once you abandon the insanely overpriced, corrupt, poorly run west coast shit hole cities - and then you counter with "yeah well how can someone with no car and $400 move to Nebraska"...

That's exactly what you want for all of us.

[kingkilburn]

Originally Posted by Corbic

Except the Eco-Terrorists will never allow it. Watch to Many Godzilla movies they have. I'm sure HBO's Chrynobel did nothing to help.

The eco authoritarians can eat a dick. Nuclear is the only future we currently have. Thorium powered container ships would nearly end global warming by themselves. This is something the navy has been looking into for years but with little support. Imagine a fighting force that never has to port for fuel and water.

[KA24DESOneThree]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

you speak like an economist, always tossing out figures. put aside the mining, you switch people over to increased load on the electrical system which is already overwhelmed and now we're pushing for more nuclear. you can wipe your ass with wind and solar, the shit just doesnt cut the mustard

smaller more efficient cars/engines, thats the solution. but people refuse to compromise. this is one of the reason people are attracted like moths to the flame with tesla, you get great performance with no immediately visible compromise. they dont know OR care where the power comes from, or where the pollution goes as long as its not in plain sight. just like overseas manufacturing, give us our goods and fuck the slaves who have to manufacture it.

so yes, the tariffs made sense if you're trying to bring back work and manufacturing here.

Figures matter. Without figures, you have no point of reference. Metrics and KPI can be applied to nearly everything. If I say "we're up YoY," I might be referencing 0.001% or 100%.

We were talking about lithium production; if you want to bring up power production, which you're correct about having to be addressed at some point, you're correct that our outdated infrastructure and generation capabilities need upgrading.

I agree about nuclear power. My town used to get our power from San Onofre until Mitsubishi fucked the dog on QC. Combine nuclear power with fairly wide-spread adoption of something similar to Tesla's Powerwall, by which you can equalize grid utilization and reduce the peak strains to mitigate issues caused by charging mass numbers of electric cars.

Smaller, more-efficient cars would be a step in the right direction- provided that the government and/or automakers put Gasoline Particulate Filters on direct-injected gasoline-powered cars. Otherwise, particulate emissions will continue to have deleterious effects on people located near highways and in basins with low air exchange rates. The particulate emissions also cause issues with groundwater pollution, the long-term effects of which we're still not entirely certain.

[kingkilburn]

There's a few technologies coming up that would be city block/neighborhood scale batteries that help solve the issues with the timing of solar and wind. There's still generation problems that will never be solved under the current paradigm. We need a retirement date on natural gas and coal. Just like the covid vaccines, technology has a way of showing up when it's necessary.

[ixfxi]

Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree

Figures matter. Without figures, you have no point of reference. Metrics and KPI can be applied to nearly everything. If I say "we're up YoY," I might be referencing 0.001% or 100%.

I agree about nuclear power. My town used to get our power from San Onofre until Mitsubishi fucked the dog on QC. Combine nuclear power with fairly wide-spread adoption of something similar to Tesla's Powerwall, by which you can equalize grid utilization and reduce the peak strains to mitigate issues caused by charging mass numbers of electric cars.

Smaller, more-efficient cars would be a step in the right direction- provided that the government and/or automakers put Gasoline Particulate Filters on direct-injected gasoline-powered cars. Otherwise, particulate emissions will continue to have deleterious effects on people located near highways and in basins with low air exchange rates. The particulate emissions also cause issues with groundwater pollution, the long-term effects of which we're still not entirely certain.

particulates are a non issue. adding filters on diesels (or gas?) is a joke, its just another money maker for manufacturers and more bullshit regulation. tell me how your fancy numbers and metrics work when your nuclear casks at san onofre are enjoying a beach front view with no where to go. that nuclear waste is here to stay. you'll be dead before its dealt with. dont believe me? the SSFL in southern california has been unable to figure out what to do with the nuclear contamination at that facility for over 50 years. any research you do shows that each gov agency is just as corrupt as the next. in the meantime, people think LA is a great place to live. yeah right, its a toxic mess.

the only solution is americans, or better yet humans, need to dial back our consumption with everything we do. thats the ONLY solution because WE are the problem.

man does not have the intelligence NOR capacity to safely harness nuclear power. shit, killburn doesnt even have the ability to make a valid point half the time. haha

[KA24DESOneThree]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

particulates are a non issue. adding filters on diesels (or gas?) is a joke, its just another money maker for manufacturers and more bullshit regulation. tell me how your fancy numbers and metrics work when your nuclear casks at san onofre are enjoying a beach front view with no where to go. that nuclear waste is here to stay. you'll be dead before its dealt with. dont believe me? the SSFL in southern california has been unable to figure out what to do with the nuclear contamination at that facility for over 50 years. any research you do shows that each gov agency is just as corrupt as the next. in the meantime, people think LA is a great place to live. yeah right, its a toxic mess.

the only solution is americans, or better yet humans, need to dial back our consumption with everything we do. thats the ONLY solution because WE are the problem.

Particulates are an issue. A simple search on your favorite search engine will teach you the error of your ways quickly- this isn't something you can just feel. Remember the term "facts don't care about your feelings?" This is one of those instances.

I thought you were advocating for nuclear power, not against. I am in favor of. If you don't think solar, wind, or nuclear can provide for our power needs, then you're thinking like a nihilist with similar outcome guaranteed.

Originally Posted by Corbic

words

'Kay.

PS- Do you know why I'm an ass to you? Because you're a read-between-the-lines, put words in peoples' mouths, make an assumption about someone and stick with it, closed-minded wet fart.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

the only solution is americans, or better yet humans, need to dial back our consumption with everything we do. thats the ONLY solution because WE are the problem.

If only like a virus happened that would help cull the herd...

Imagine what would happen to property prices in LA if like 10% of everyone just *poof*.

But noooooo.....

What these idiots don't realize is this shit fixes itself faster, organically, without government intervention.

Europe and USA have declining birthrates... Why? Because people realized they'd rather go to Cancun then have 6 kids. Additionally they didn't need the child labor, elderly care nor fear a 80% mortality rate before 12 years of age.

Eventually South America, India, China, the Middle East and Africa will realize this when they want to have nice things.

Pollution, once you economically can enjoy life and plant to live past 50, you kinda naturally start caring. Just look at all the western Planeteers pissing selves and compare that to the 3rd world's no fucks given.

So what I'm saying is, we need to crush the CPP and put Africa and South America under Technocratic Rule.

India is on a good path, but it's along one because of that pesky Democracy garbage.

[kingkilburn]

You know how you decrease birthrates in a positive way? You're going to love this.

Better pay, free education, access to healthcare, and equal rights. All the places with shrinking birthrates treat women, children, and minorities with respect and decency.

P.S.
Africa and South have had more than enough intervention from white people. They need their sovereignty respected first and foremost.