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Old 10-31-2017, 07:36 PM   #1
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New Garrett G-Series turbos!

These look perfect for smaller displacement engines! Finally some new turbines in the long-in-the-tooth Garrett lineup. Mar-M super alloy! Definitely some cool stuff. Hopefully more are headed our way.



https://www.full-race.com/blog/garre...turbochargers/
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Old 11-01-2017, 06:51 AM   #2
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not that I know much about turbo's but the numbers on the 550 turbo look well small.

a gt2860rs has inducer 47,exducer 60 ar 60 and exhaust exducer 54 and this new turbo is gonna give you 200hp more.

a efr 6758 is inlet inducer 54 exducer 67, exhaust exducer58 and wont do 400 on an sr20
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:58 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gaz_moose View Post
not that I know much about turbo's but the numbers on the 550 turbo look well small.

a gt2860rs has inducer 47,exducer 60 ar 60 and exhaust exducer 54 and this new turbo is gonna give you 200hp more.

a efr 6758 is inlet inducer 54 exducer 67, exhaust exducer58 and wont do 400 on an sr20
Think you might be confused mate, a 6258 will do 400whp on an SR20 on E85...
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Old 11-01-2017, 05:01 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gaz_moose View Post
not that I know much about turbo's but the numbers on the 550 turbo look well small.

a gt2860rs has inducer 47,exducer 60 ar 60 and exhaust exducer 54 and this new turbo is gonna give you 200hp more.

a efr 6758 is inlet inducer 54 exducer 67, exhaust exducer58 and wont do 400 on an sr20

A 6758 will make 450WHP on a SR on full song. A 7163 will make over 500WHP on a SR.

I think your (HP) figures on the EFR are........incorrect.

Also, EFRs are NOT dyno queens. The biggest mistake people always make with EFRs is comparing strictly on a piece of paper without actually experiencing one.
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Old 11-01-2017, 09:46 PM   #5
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what really interests me is if they will offer a direct bolt on replacement for stock s14/s15. They offer stock upgrades for the GT and GTX, GTX II series so I'm hoping they will offer one for this new G series. It's so much easier going bottom mount and running off the shelf parts.
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Old 11-02-2017, 02:06 AM   #6
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Bottom mount external gated stock manifold is where its at lol. Wish I had finished my TD06 setup on stock manifold lol.
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Old 11-02-2017, 06:12 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EDacIouSX View Post
what really interests me is if they will offer a direct bolt on replacement for stock s14/s15. They offer stock upgrades for the GT and GTX, GTX II series so I'm hoping they will offer one for this new G series. It's so much easier going bottom mount and running off the shelf parts.
Yeah but 5-bolt downpipes and bolted inlets and outlets suck. Plus if you’re really talking about replacing the compressor cover, you’re probably going to be sacrificing flow. They make an internal gate T25 housing, I’m sure adapting it won’t be hard.
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Old 11-02-2017, 07:42 AM   #8
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I am glad they finally redesigned thier 30+ year old wheel design. The GTX billet wheels were fantastic and they always lacked in turbine wheel, which is where the meat of the potatoes exists.

Curious to see how these compare to the EFRs. The race is on!

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Old 11-02-2017, 07:59 AM   #9
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I'm really only interested in seeing side by side comparisons of its similarly sized garrett competitors. Say its sizable to a 2871. I want to see side by side data on both.
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Old 11-02-2017, 08:50 AM   #10
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which is where the meet of the potatoes exists.
*Meat and potatoes
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Old 11-02-2017, 09:42 AM   #11
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*Meat and potatoes
Hahaha! Thanks
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Old 11-02-2017, 10:06 AM   #12
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What im trying to gather here is how the hell this tiny turbo is good for 550whp?

if this is true im throwing my gtx3076 in the trash cause I'd imagine this thing is going to have instant spool on a ka.
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Old 11-02-2017, 10:31 AM   #13
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What im trying to gather here is how the hell this tiny turbo is good for 550whp?

if this is true im throwing my gtx3076 in the trash cause I'd imagine this thing is going to have instant spool on a ka.
you and me both. I've got a gtx3071 for sale if this pans out!
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it'll fit JANK.. and no one likes Jank except Broke ass zilvians.
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Old 11-02-2017, 04:43 PM   #14
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Here is the G25 550 in red, and the GTX2867R Gen II in white. The maps are scaled horizontally, but not vertically. Still shows what it needs to. The G25 compressor coupled with the new higher flowing turbine should be killer.

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Old 11-02-2017, 07:46 PM   #15
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It seems like if scaled vertically the maps would almost be right on top of each other.
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Old 11-03-2017, 06:19 AM   #16
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It seems like if scaled vertically the maps would almost be right on top of each other.
Seems that way to me

However, the 7163 EFRs (just an example) were supposed to be 500 BHP turbos and the EVO boys are squeezing 600 WHP+ from them (over 700BHP).

If factoring real life, the real test is in drivability, power under the curve, boost response, etc since they have a newly designed wheel.

However, looking through all the similarities, they almost "literally" pulled the description and design (twin entry cooling ports on both sides of the housing, G series design turbine wheel, oil restrictor fitting in the housing, speed sensor, compact V band outlet, etc etc) straight from the EFR turbos. Garrett literally lifted just about every design feature from the EFR........Apart from the packaging with the internal gate, I will still stick with my EFR unless proven otherwise as the MAPS do not seem to pose an improvement over the standard GTX. If they make a bolt on with a good flowing gate however..........

That goes to show how far ahead of the game EFRs were to Garrett.
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Old 11-03-2017, 08:00 AM   #17
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Also, whats the speed sensor for? Is it required?

When I was turbo shopping last year I wanted to look into an EFR, but there wasn't enough information on the KA for a platform with a similar set up to me because 240 owners are cheap fucks.
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Old 11-03-2017, 08:13 AM   #18
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It seems like if scaled vertically the maps would almost be right on top of each other.
Close, but as you can see, the new 60mm wheel outflows the GenII 67mm wheel. Pretty impressive.
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Old 11-03-2017, 08:37 AM   #19
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Also, whats the speed sensor for? Is it required?

.
Gamma-ti wheel and overspeeding. Keep it under 140,000 RPM is the general consensus for the B1 frames.

But again, evo boys making 600+ WHP what would consider serious overspeed, but I have not seen any failures as of yet (only engines going kablamooo)
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Old 11-03-2017, 10:56 AM   #20
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Last Garrett turbo i sold was leaking out of the box, this is the 4th time i have something like this happen. I have no more faith in Garrett, Borg Warner is where it's at!
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Old 11-03-2017, 12:50 PM   #21
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Close, but as you can see, the new 60mm wheel outflows the GenII 67mm wheel. Pretty impressive.
agreed! crazy to see how far the tech has come in just a short amount of time
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Old 11-03-2017, 03:28 PM   #22
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Quote:
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Seems that way to me

However, looking through all the similarities, they almost "literally" pulled the description and design (twin entry cooling ports on both sides of the housing, G series design turbine wheel, oil restrictor fitting in the housing, speed sensor, compact V band outlet, etc etc) straight from the EFR turbos. Garrett literally lifted just about every design feature from the EFR........Apart from the packaging with the internal gate, I will still stick with my EFR unless proven otherwise as the MAPS do not seem to pose an improvement over the standard GTX. If they make a bolt on with a good flowing gate however..........

That goes to show how far ahead of the game EFRs were to Garrett.


So do these turbos out perform borg warner turbos? Honestly if they're a copy paste of borg warner tech, that is just lame... rather go w/ borg warner at that point.
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Old 11-03-2017, 05:41 PM   #23
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four cylinder turbo is amazing.

everything I've seen with v8's still has me constantly saying, "well, the 4-cylinder might not XXX but it sure can YYY" and giving my old SR credit. The thing that killed it for me was the clutch, constant traffic here took the fun out of it. And 4-cylinder auto just doesn't seem right.

Oh, the thread title. Right. So you guys realize that you are basically comparing 77% efficient compressors with "~76%" efficient compressors, right? Like, one turbo isn't "better" because it's compressor map is bigger, that just means the compressor is bigger. You are getting a very similar compressor discharge temperature across the board.

The performance aspect you are looking to compare isn't in the compressor map at all; that aspect is supported by how the dynamics of the exhaust plays out, not only the turbine wheel but what comes before/after that wheel. In other words, when comparing two similar sized compressors at say, 20psi, both discharge very similar temperatures of air if they are in similar regions of the compressor map (both maps look the same right). So any significant difference in power isn't going to be due to the compressor, comparing mass flow rate and looking at the map isn't going to reveal these discreet behaviors.
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Old 11-03-2017, 06:46 PM   #24
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four cylinder turbo is amazing.

everything I've seen with v8's still has me constantly saying, "well, the 4-cylinder might not XXX but it sure can YYY" and giving my old SR credit. The thing that killed it for me was the clutch, constant traffic here took the fun out of it. And 4-cylinder auto just doesn't seem right.

Oh, the thread title. Right. So you guys realize that you are basically comparing 77% efficient compressors with "~76%" efficient compressors, right? Like, one turbo isn't "better" because it's compressor map is bigger, that just means the compressor is bigger. You are getting a very similar compressor discharge temperature across the board.

The performance aspect you are looking to compare isn't in the compressor map at all; that aspect is supported by how the dynamics of the exhaust plays out, not only the turbine wheel but what comes before/after that wheel. In other words, when comparing two similar sized compressors at say, 20psi, both discharge very similar temperatures of air if they are in similar regions of the compressor map (both maps look the same right). So any significant difference in power isn't going to be due to the compressor, comparing mass flow rate and looking at the map isn't going to reveal these discreet behaviors.
Except when one compressor is significantly smaller, meaning less mass and intertia... and when the compressor is more efficient, the turbine has to do less work, and when the turbine is more efficient, you get less emap...
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Old 11-03-2017, 08:01 PM   #25
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Except when one compressor is significantly smaller, meaning less mass and intertia... and when the compressor is more efficient, the turbine has to do less work, and when the turbine is more efficient, you get less emap...
You can't see compressor wheel mass on a compressor map, and you can't see somebody's exhaust setup or camshaft/head setup over the internet, which all will affect turbine work.

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that aspect is supported by how the dynamics of the exhaust plays out, not only the turbine wheel but what comes before/after that wheel.
Its exactly what I said
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Old 11-03-2017, 09:43 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingtal0n View Post
You can't see compressor wheel mass on a compressor map, and you can't see somebody's exhaust setup or camshaft/head setup over the internet, which all will affect turbine work.



Its exactly what I said
Must be some new super dense aluminum for a wheel smaller in every dimension not to be lighter...

We’re not comparing engines here, we’re comparing turbos. The turbine to compressor relationship stays the same on every turbo, regardless of the engine it’s attached to.

This is a discussion. Nobody is trying to prove that this is the latest and greatest turbo of all time. I’m simply excited for new possibilities and am comparing it in ways I can to others currently on the market. It’s fun and interesting to me.
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Old 11-04-2017, 04:23 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoorMans180SX View Post
Think you might be confused mate, a 6758 will do 400whp on an SR20 on E85...
we don't really get E85 over here in England. (well not easily)

have they released any prices for these new garrett's yet?
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Old 11-04-2017, 05:41 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gaz_moose View Post
we don't really get E85 over here in England. (well not easily)

have they released any prices for these new garrett's yet?
It will make 400 HP on pump........

2K for far for street pricing
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Old 11-04-2017, 10:20 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gaz_moose View Post
we don't really get E85 over here in England. (well not easily)

have they released any prices for these new garrett's yet?
I meant 6258 when I typed it...

this is 6258, E85, stock cams, greddy intake.

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Old 11-07-2017, 04:08 PM   #30
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MotoIQ breaking down these vs Gen1 and 2 GTX. Some nice info about turbine work vs compressor and the reduction in intertia from smaller wheels that flow more.

http://www.motoiq.com/MagazineArticl...ochargers.aspx
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