[codyace]

Originally Posted by RBMadess

This is 2011... do you get direct injection?? NO. Do you get Variable cam timing??? NO Variable Valve lift? NO.

No...but

-Do any of those features help determine the power output? Nope
-Do they help drivability? Nope.

You go find me a 'directed injected' 'variable cam' 'variable lift' 'overhead cam' V8 to even gear near the durability, and power potential of that GM engine in street form. This side of a pure compeittion based motor, it doesn't exist, and even then it's hard to find...look at GM being penalized for being dominant in their ALMS cars...and the Vipers before that.

But I can understand why you'd want that tech, I mean the new E92 M3 v8 is nice...if you like torquless, tapped out, and overly strung engines. BORING. They do sound nice though, so it's a push.

Maybe its' my track based and performance based background that clout my vision. I love simple. Simple is reliable. Simple is fast. Simple wins. Then again when you get involved with Nascar type tech, you'll realize that for a 50 year old design, it's probably got darn equal RD and tech that an F1 engine does. 10,000 rpm, 600 hp, that can go 500 miles of WOT and be ok? That's simply rediculous, especially from an engine platform that was NEVER designed to do that from the drawing board. Sure it's not as pretty as the 19,000 rpm F1 motors, specifically designed to spin high from the moment the CNC machine tears into the block of alumimum to build the one off motor, but damn it's just as impressive if you ask me. THe only thing more impressive in motorsports to me are Top Fueler's...they simply shouldn't work, but they do.

Originally Posted by RBMadess

Any moron could take a high displacement v8, slap a supercharger and make 600hp.

Undoubtedly. The difference though is that NOT every moron can design a 600 hp blown engine to have 100,000 mile reliability. That's the difference...especially in factory form.

Originally Posted by RBMadess

I have driven a z06, c5 and c6. its about as exciting to drive as my infiniti.

On track or on the street? I could care less about the highway honestly. Having also driven 35c and a 37c on track too, I can say that they are fun. To even remotely think (from a driver persepctive) they are near a Zo6 is laughable. FWIW, I could care less about all of the creature comforts on track.

Originally Posted by RBMadess

How is a forced induction v8 engine that makes 102.9 hp per liter considered efficient?? a naturaly aspriraded honda F20 4 cylinder engine makes 123hp per liter... simple, yes. Simple as a truck engine invented in the 1800's. And if you want to divide those numbers by the number of pistons to paint a clearer picture of how efficient the ls9 is, well that would just be embarrassing. And just tho throw this out there... GTR makes 80.8 hp per cylinder, LS9 makes 79.5 and these are 2009 numbers, the 2012 GTR makes 530hp

Ahhh HP per liter, ricer math. My s14 makes 200 HP per liter, does that mean it's better than all of them? Not a chance. Efficiency should never be measured by liter power...it's sort of like slalom numbers. Neat figure but has ZERO relationship to real world performance.

...I can see now you're more of a magazine reader, less a track guy. Nothing wrong with that though so dont' get upset. In the end there is a reason you see people swapping LSX into everything, and not Ford Mod Motors, or BMW engines, or Hemi's (which are actually impressive engines, just heavy)...cost, simplicity, and ease of use. Hell there is a reason why people have been putting American Small blocks into everything since their onset. To date, a proper AC Cobra is one of the fastest cars you could 'build'. Why is it you don't see 4.0 audi engines? 5.0 Infiniti engines?

Originally Posted by RBMadess

Why package 4 cams?? because it makes for a better engine.

Bigger and heavier too, not to mention weight higher in the chassis too Weight higher up sucks. Ever see how big a OHC to a OHV engine is?



That's a 5.4 ford and a 5.0 ford. Granted the 5.0 is not what I'm arguing about, but it's the same 'size' as a LS1 for sake of argument. Lets see, a 331 vs a 346. The ford is bigger, heavier, less cubes, less power, less torque, and 4x as expensive to build. BUt it's technologically superior so it's better? Package, weight, power, torque...LSX wins that all day. Scoring cool guy points on the forums, maybe not. Fast track times for sure though.

Originally Posted by RBMadess

powerband. Just because chevy can't make a proper DOHC V8 doesn't mean that a pushrod engine dominates the world, it just means chevy guys are lazy. Ask yourself why the rest of the world builds dohc engines, do a little research outside the chevy fanboy forums. I hope my idiocy entretained you.

Chevy did. LT5. 370 HP and Trq, in the mid 90's. These engines went on to help design modern Northstars, another fantastic overhead cam engine from them. You talk about me needing to leave the forums, maybe you should leave the Super Street magazine on the stand, and actually get involved with the performance world.

PS: I don't spend any time on Chevy Forums, well..limited. I'm a Ford guy. Even I can admit where my brand is flawed.

Originally Posted by Jimbo_Moone

while i whole heartedly agree on the half as usable thing... let's re-examine the numbers. I just want to know why we're comparing models that are $20,000+ apart? I want everyone to get along, so here you go. they are all the greatest thing ever in the whole wide world... in their respective price segments. YAY! everyone gets a slushee

Originally Posted by RBMadess

I agree 100%. the GTR is just a little better.