Garrett GTX2863R SR Install and external gate setup

[Pstl_pete]

Finished this install up a while ago but I figured I'd post it up on here as well since some of you may be interested in it.

I am hoping to get it tune before the end of September (have another project taking precedence) but it'll be good to see how it compares with a 2871R turbo.

http://speed.academy/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Nissan-240SX-Garrett-Turbo-GTX-Upgrade019.jpg
The biggest issue I ran into while installing the turbo is having to make a custom intake setup, not a big deal though.

http://speed.academy/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Nissan-240SX-Garrett-Turbo-GTX-Upgrade024.jpg

http://speed.academy/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Nissan-240SX-Garrett-Turbo-GTX-Upgrade029.jpg
Welded up some 3-inch piping I had laying around and had myself a decent intake.

http://speed.academy/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Nissan-240SX-Garrett-Turbo-GTX-Upgrade026.jpg
Also had to add a quick 90 deg bend on the compressor side to mate it to the IC cold side piping.

http://speed.academy/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Nissan-240SX-Garrett-Turbo-GTX-Upgrade021.jpg
The GTX2863R is internally gated but I wanted more precise boost control so I welded up the gate.

http://speed.academy/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Nissan-240SX-Garrett-Turbo-GTX-Upgrade046.jpg
And added a provision for an external wastegate on the stock manifold.

http://speed.academy/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Nissan-240SX-Garrett-Turbo-GTX-Upgrade017.jpg
Built this return tube with a bellows piece since I was told it would crack without it.

http://speed.academy/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Nissan-240SX-Garrett-Turbo-GTX-Upgrade038.jpg
Went with a Comp-40 Turbosmart wastegate since its compact in size and Ive always had good success with their products.

http://speed.academy/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Nissan-240SX-Garrett-Turbo-GTX-Upgrade043.jpg
And here's the final setup. Hoping that this will make a conservative 320-340whp at the wheels on pump gas and around 15psi. I love how I got to re-use all the stock heat shielding components. No heat issues here!

If you wanna see more detailed install pics and explanation you can check it out here: http://speed.academy/sr20det-s14-nissan-garrett-gtx2863r-upgrade/

[e1_griego]

I like the wastegate recirc a lot. I ran my screamer piped for a while, and now it just has a flex section at the bottom and runs back into the downpipe towards the end. Your solution is much more elegant.

[lg54]

looking to see how it will compare with a 2871 subd

[az_240]

Very cool. Did you by chance use an electronic boost controller on the 2871r? I've been wondering how much better a setup like this (recirc EWG) is compared to using a quality internal wastegate and EBC.

Looking forward to seeing the results.

[jr_ss]

Very cool. Did you by chance use an electronic boost controller on the 2871r? I've been wondering how much better a setup like this (recirc EWG) is compared to using a quality internal wastegate and EBC.

Looking forward to seeing the results.

No comparison really. You're trying to control exhaust gases flowing throw a "quarter" sized hole vs a 38 or 44mm hole on the ex. The external will offer better control almost all of time.

[e1_griego]

I had the internal gate ported on my 2863 and am still running the internal gate.

I went from 2871 .64 to gtx2863 .64 and the gtx spools about 400-500rpm sooner. Still on stock cams. I was running 12-14psi gate with greddy profec on the 2871, now running 7psi gate with same EBC. I have the gain turned all the way up and it still doesn't spike (running 14psi) so I kind of want to go to the 12-14psi so I can set the gain right to edge of spike.

[Edwin562]

Nicely done.

[az_240]

No comparison really. You're trying to control exhaust gases flowing throw a "quarter" sized hole vs a 38 or 44mm hole on the ex. The external will offer better control almost all of time.

Better control yes... but is it really worth the hassle for a build pushing 350whp or less (15-18psi)? You could also port the wg flapper hole a bit on the turbo and run a divorced elbow to help with boost issues...

[RalliartRsX]

From what I have seen, adding an external gate also frees up some horsepower. On the smaller turbos (GT28R, etc), we were typically seeing 10-15 WHP just from going from an internal gate stock manifold, to adding a V-band and going external (one of the reasons Garrett added a "division" between the exhaust and the internal gate on the S15 turbos).

The inherent flow restriction in the smaller exhaust housing with the internal gate was what was deemed the issue.

[Pstl_pete]

I've got an EMS Series 2 so my boost control is built into that and will be optimized for maximum response which is why I spent all the time building the external setup. I went with this turbo to have stock like response.

I do agree that the internal gated housing and the T28 flange inherently aren't ideal for flow but this will be an experiment to see how this all works. I really wanted to keep the stock manifold and heat shielding so I'm crossing my fingers all this time and effort is worth it.

[Pstl_pete]

Oh and I also just finished the exhaust setup for the car if any of you are interested.

AyNDQUXYX2c
http://youtu.be/AyNDQUXYX2c

[az_240]

Nice video, can't wait to see how it all turns out.

Kinda at a crossroads with the IWG vs EWG (already have a pbm cobra downpipe made for IWG) which is why I ask.

[e1_griego]

I have PBM cobras on both of my cars. For the 67 with external I just plumbed in the recirc towards the back.

[jamg]

i was so happy that my motor was out of the car when i was installing the tomei oil pan. Lol

[BossHogg]

haha you use one of my favorite welding gloves. To bad they discontinued them.

[az_240]

I have PBM cobras on both of my cars. For the 67 with external I just plumbed in the recirc towards the back.

Yeah I remember you mentioned that in another thread but I'm worried it won't flow right with the divorced elbow/downpipe and would hate to chop/weld for the recirc. I think I'd go with a regular elbow and either buy or have someone fab up a downpipe with flex section if I went with the EWG.

[So Make Like]

Stock sr with a external wg gtx2863r? I really wanna see this,
Subbed!

[Zolvovo]

google brought me here!
will be back to check your progress

bolted up my gtx2860 as is and having severe high rpm boost drop now
was told i need an ebc but nobody i know has to use an ebc

good info

[So Make Like]

What kind of controller are you using now? Manual or none?

[Zolvovo]

manual and it spikes too

[RurouniMidnight]

Awesome and clean install, just got my car running about a month ago with gt2871r using tial 38mm on stock manifold. Feels awesome and boost is dead on at 19psi with no spikes. I think eventually i would like to swap out for a gtx2863 or 67 with e85.

[derass]

google brought me here!
will be back to check your progress

bolted up my gtx2860 as is and having severe high rpm boost drop now
was told i need an ebc but nobody i know has to use an ebc

good info

What engine? Perhaps your airflow requirements are simply greater than what your turbo can provide, resulting in the pressure ratio falling off at high RPM.

[Zolvovo]

SR with pulsar mani

yeah i think you're right might've blown it with the turbo choice :ugh:

so anybody think an ebc is worth exploring or no?

(sorry op)

[xilovelsdx]

So the top nipple on the waste gate just vents to the atmosphere?

[Pstl_pete]

So the top nipple on the waste gate just vents to the atmosphere?

Yes, there are different ways to setup the external gate but I wont be pushing crazy amounts of boost so there's no need for the top nipple.

[Scott@FontanaNissan]

very nice looking setup! we also run Garrett turbos on all of our shop cars. the GTX2863 should be a blast to drive. to take advantage of the GTX wheel you should give E85 a shot and push it to the higher boost levels if your engine allows.

-Juan

[Pstl_pete]

Alright, finally got the car on a dyno to see how well the GTX2863R performs. We ran into some nagging knock issues so 15psi is as high as it was run with the catalytic converter but it made 318whp and 286ft-lbs.


It spools so fast and power is incredibly linear! I'm loving this turbo setup Especially with the external wastegate, there's zero boost creep or surging.

The chart below has my old stock T28 graph for reference.
http://speed.academy/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Nissan-240SX-Garrett-GTX2863R-Dyno-008.jpg

With a test pipe, boost jumped to 17psi and the setup made 333whp and 302ft-lbs so this turbo has the capability of making decent power at higher boost pressures.

Anyways, watch the video below for all the details: http://youtu.be/QjaK5n86IjY

[Dboyizmlg]

Was this on 91 octane?

[hobbs]

Are you controlling VCT with the AEM V2?

[Pstl_pete]

Was this on 91 octane?

It over half 94 octane and the rest was 91 octane that was in the tank for 1 year.

[Pstl_pete]

Are you controlling VCT with the AEM V2?

Yes sir, we played with the timing a bit and actually had good results with it.

[Dboyizmlg]

My opinion, I don't see a bigger advantage with this turbo compared with a GT2871r .64 a/r.
I've seen similar graphs with the 2871r at/or around the same boost you had it at.

I think the GTX2867r .64a/r would be the better choice with a real nice mid to top end hp.

I'm not hating, just that my opinion is make it easier and go with 2871r (bolt on turbo with not much fab work), OR the GTX2867r.

Thanks for sharing this with the community!

Hope you switch over to E85 to boost higher and we can see a nicer better graph.

[e1_griego]

I went from 2871 .64 a/r to gtx2863 and i'm getting 400-500 rpm quicker spool and just a lot better transient response. I'm getting a few more percentage duty cycle at the same psi, but I think I would buy the gtx2867, though, like you say.

The 2867 in my coupe spools almost the same but obviously carries higher.

[fthst]

I like the wastegate recirc a lot. I ran my screamer piped for a while, and now it just has a flex section at the bottom and runs back into the downpipe towards the end. Your solution is much more elegant. http://financede.com/apple/images/40.gif

[Pstl_pete]

My opinion, I don't see a bigger advantage with this turbo compared with a GT2871r .64 a/r.
I've seen similar graphs with the 2871r at/or around the same boost you had it at.

I think the GTX2867r .64a/r would be the better choice with a real nice mid to top end hp.

I'm not hating, just that my opinion is make it easier and go with 2871r (bolt on turbo with not much fab work), OR the GTX2867r.

Thanks for sharing this with the community!

Hope you switch over to E85 to boost higher and we can see a nicer better graph.

I agree the extra plumbing on the custom intake is a bit of work so it could turn some people away but my 2871R S14 SR was noticeably laggier than this one and I wanted the response over peak power since I don't really run a lot of high speed tracks locally. I think it's a matter of preference with turbo choice, there's always going to be a trade off.

Oh and if I can convince Garrett to send me a 2867R I'll see if I can do a comparo testing the two. It'd be nice to see which one is the better choice!

[Martino]

Pete, throw my GTX30 on for some result testing haha.

[Javi802]

Hey, Pete, this is off topic kind of....but are you selling your t2871 by chance?

[e1_griego]

Oh and if I can convince Garrett to send me a 2867R I'll see if I can do a comparo testing the two. It'd be nice to see which one is the better choice!

I have both, and I think the 67 is the way to go. But the 63 isn't a bad choice by any means.

[Dboyizmlg]

I agree the extra plumbing on the custom intake is a bit of work so it could turn some people away but my 2871R S14 SR was noticeably laggier than this one and I wanted the response over peak power since I don't really run a lot of high speed tracks locally. I think it's a matter of preference with turbo choice, there's always going to be a trade off.

Oh and if I can convince Garrett to send me a 2867R I'll see if I can do a comparo testing the two. It'd be nice to see which one is the better choice!

I would love to see a dyno graph with this turbo @20psi on E85!

Yes, responsive is very important to me as well. But I do like my turbo to pull a bit more in top end, versus it falling off after 6k (your graph stays pretty consistent and nice, but a bit more up top would be sweet).
I understand what you are saying and I agree.
Just do us a favor and go E85, would love to see it.

[Pstl_pete]

Pete, throw my GTX30 on for some result testing haha.

If it were an easy swap I'd be all over it haha but it never is haha.

[Pstl_pete]

Hey, Pete, this is off topic kind of....but are you selling your t2871 by chance?

No sir, that one is long gone already.

[Pstl_pete]

What kind of controller are you using now? Manual or none? http://financede.com/apple/images/40.gif

I'm using the AEM EMS built in boost control, so essentially is a 3 port boost solenoid. Best way to have full control over boost IMO.

[Pstl_pete]

I would love to see a dyno graph with this turbo @20psi on E85!

Yes, responsive is very important to me as well. But I do like my turbo to pull a bit more in top end, versus it falling off after 6k (your graph stays pretty consistent and nice, but a bit more up top would be sweet).
I understand what you are saying and I agree.
Just do us a favor and go E85, would love to see it.

E85 is too much work for me. I don't want to have to change out the fuel system for it plus it's hard to find here in Ontario. If anything I'll give meth injection a try.