No brakes need help

[Mr. Spool]

My brakes have been feeling abit week lately. they felt like there was air in the line. So I decided to bleed the brakes. I did the driver side rear and it went fine. I then did the driver side front. at first all that came out was air. Then I finaly put a suction hand pump on it and pumped the brakes with my foot as well. Some fluid came out then just air. I tried at this for a while longer and nothing happened, just air. Now I have no brakes. Does any body have any thoughts on this. could it be the caliper or could the brake line be clogged. any help would be apreciated. Thanks.

[thx247]

You did not bleed the brakes properly, and you probably just have air in the lines. You can do a search on this site for how to bleed the brakes properly. I suggest getting a helper to do the pumping on the pedal while you work on the calipers. One other thing, make sure you take off the parking brake before you start working on the rear calipers.

[Mr. Spool]

Thanks for the imput, I must have mis stated what was done. I had my budy do the pumping on the brakes and I worked the caliper, The only time that I was able to get any fluid out was when I used the hand pump teamed with the foot pedal. The other thing about it was that the brake fluid in the reservoir did not go down any.

[thx247]

The fluid didn't go down at all? Uh....weird. If you open the bleeder all the way you really should be getting fluid after a few pumps on the pedal. It would be VERY strange to have a brake line clogged.

[the head]

did yousee if ou ould get any fluid out of the fornt passenger side brake ? or did you only mess with the drivers side

[Mr. Spool]

I only messed with the driver side brake. reason being is that I was looking for the brake that had alot of air in the line. When I did it after the first big squirt of fluid I didnt get any more after that. i thought it wierd to that a brake line could be clogged. Are the driver side and passenger side connected.

also does anybody know if the caliper and or brake line from an abs 96se will fit on a non abs 96se I figured that I could change the brake line and caliper and see which one is messed up. lastly is there any chance that it is the caliper.

[Sil-Abc]

try bleeding ur system in the correct order...i believe its driver rear, passenger rear, driver front, passenger front (from first to last). if that doesnt work it could be ur master cylinder i believe. somethin like that happened to me 2 days before drift day >:-(

[adey]

Some thoughts...
Unless you have speed bleeders, remember that you need to close the bleeder screw BEFORE he lifts up on the brake pedal... otherwise you'll just be sucking and spewing air out each pump and introducing yet more air to your lines. Also don't forget to have the brake MC reservoir OPEN and have some towel around there so you don't leak brake fluid all over the engine bay. Lastly, don't forget to keep adding fluid to the reservoir as you bleed!! if you get air in there from the reservoir you need to start all over again. :d
Good luck!

[Mr. Spool]

Thanks for the imput, I will try doing it in order and see what happens. I wonder if that would really effect the way it was bleeding. When the master cylinder goes bad what does it do. The reason I ask is becouse the back bleed just fine.

[Mr. Spool]

i tried the passanger side front and it is not working either. what happens when the master cylinder goes bad. And does any body know what happens when the brake booster goes out as well. Thanks.

[Kid Zelda]

i tried the passanger side front and it is not working either. what happens when the master cylinder goes bad. And does any body know what happens when the brake booster goes out as well. Thanks.

Brake boosters hardly ever go out, if it does, braking effort will be harder because the seal use to separate the vacuum and the atmospheric pressure it gone.

M/C gone bad, it will leak out, or when come to a stop and hold the brake, the pedal will drop slowly and you have to pump it to get some pedal height back.

[teampro687]

Sounds like the master cylinder.

[Mr. Spool]

When I try to use it to stop, it just feels like there is nothing there, but it rises right back up. I would think the master cylinder is good, but I am running into the same trouble on both front calipers. any body else have a master cylinder go bad.

[Mr. Spool]

Also when I tried bleeding the brakes yesterday I relized that the reservior on the master cylinder is staying full and no fluid is being pumped out. Could this mean the mc is going, or am I just doing something wronge

[element240]

you're supposed to start from the brake caliper farthest away from the mc, and work your way up... so it would be, rear passenger side, rear driver side, front passenger side, and then driver side..

i would call up the local nissan dealership and talk to a tech or service manager and ask them, they would have more experience about your situation.

[Mr. Spool]

If I do not do it in this order will I end up having issues when I try to bleed the brakes. I am going to try it again today. The thing that has me baffled is that the master cylinder is not pushing any fluid out to the front brakes.

[Kid Zelda]

If I do not do it in this order will I end up having issues when I try to bleed the brakes. I am going to try it again today. The thing that has me baffled is that the master cylinder is not pushing any fluid out to the front brakes.

Stop trying and start replacing :)
If the fluid is not pushing out, the primary seal on the primary piston is shot and not pushing aginst the piston to apply brakes, its just sending hte fluid right back into the M/C

[Mr. Spool]

I just got back in from trying again. Heres what happend, I did the rears, they worked just fine. The fronts however did not. when my budy would push down it would move air into the hose, I would then close the niple. as I re oppened it the fluid that was already in the bottle I was using would shoot right back into the hose and almost into the caliper, then my buddy would push down and the fluid would go right back. I was makeing no head way.

heres the kicker. just for giggles I pulled the driverside brakeline from the master cylinder and had my buddy push on the brake. the fluid about shot me in the eye:). so the mc is pushing the fluid and then letting it right back in, is this what you are talking about kid zelda... the bad piston. or is it possible that both of my front calipers have air leaks. This is extreemly funny becouse there are no fluid leaks but odviously there is an air leak somewhere, any more help or sudjestions would be apreciated.

[Toahk]

I hope your not just opening the screw and pumping over and over. Pump the brakes, open nipple While the pedal is depressed. Screw the nipple tight and then tell him to let up the pedal. Repeat untill you see clean fluid, and fill resivour as needed.

[Mr. Spool]

Nope, I am pumping and then opening the screw. I close it then tell him to let up. it is almost as if there is air getting in somewhere. but I figure if air is getting in then it should be leaking all over as well. what happens when the caliper goes bad. or how would I tell if the brake line is going bad.

[Mr. Spool]

Also just to be clear, I have never bleed the breaks this way, do I have the pedal all the way to the floor or just close to it when I open the valve. This may work becouse when I open the calve there will already be pressure behind it.

[91rusty240sx]

did you check your brake lines to the front calipers? have you messed with the master cylinder lately? maybe you have air in the master cylinder.

[Mr. Spool]

Is there a way to get air out of the master cylinder, That is kinda what I am thinking. There are no fluid leaks yet when I bleed the front brakes its almost as if there is an air leak or air in the master cylinder. I checked the lines as best I could by sight but saw nothing to say there is a leak in them,

[jmancini]

Sounds like bad master cylinder. Check to see if there is any leak on the booster below the MC. How many miles on your car? A replacement MC isn't too expensive, and if you've got 100k or more miles, probably time anyway.

[jtt220]

I agree, it sounds like you have a problem with the master cylinder. Of course this is assuming you are properly bleeding the system, which it sounds like you are. Where in Michigan are you located? Their's not many of us in around here, it would be nice to get to know a fellow enthusiest in the area. My email is [email protected]

[Mr. Spool]

Thanks for the replys, my 240 has 70k on it, there are no fluid leaks but there is obviously air in the cylinder somewhere. As far as I have read nobody has had a master cylinder go bad that has not leaked fluid. If it is possible to have one go bad that hasnot leaked fluid I would love to know. Thanks

[Sil-Abc]

plain and simple.....get a new mc or a rebuild kit (is there one?)

[kandyflip445]

Yes there is a way for it to go bad and not leak fluid. It's for the cup seals to go bad. I'll post some tests you can use after I get off of work.

[91rusty240sx]

i think you should remove the master cylinder and bleed it first before you go and buy a new one. remove the mc and put bleed tubes into the holes meant for the lines and have it going into the reservoir. get a stick or dowel and start pushing in the piston. push it in slowly so you dont get aeration from fluid. release piston and wait 20 seconds before pushing it in again. you should tap the mc with something to try and jolt the air bubbles out of the mc. you should do this for 20 to 30 repititions.

if this doesnt solve the problem, then you should have a bad cup seal.

[Mr. Spool]

Thanks kandyflip, I look forward to seeing these test. 91rusty, I just thought that up this afternoon when I received the new mc, I figured maybe I should bench bleed the old one. is the test you were sudjesting the same as bench bleeding the new mc?