Need some insight...im stumped. My car wont start

[davirene]

1993 KADE with a 5 speed swap. 172K Miles all stock with after market exhaust and K&N Air cleaner. Automatic S13 KADE ECU. Plenty of cranking power....RED TOP Optima with 1000 CKA

CAR has been running great....its my daily....

I drove it home last night (it was running perfect) , then about 7pm today I went to go start it.....it turned on but ran really rough....like a bad fuel injector. So I tried pulling it in the garage but only got half way in and it died.

I did spray starting fluid in....and it kicked for a second then died.... so I pulled my fuel line right above the fuel filter and that shot fuel out. Now when I spray in starting fluid it doesnt do anything....

I pulled the coil wire and had plenty of spark....I also pulled the 2month old spark plugs to check them, they are perfectly fine (they were wet with fuel). So im pretty sure the injectors are pumping....I pulled the injector plugs and they all lit up the test light...but I only have a test light. I do not have an OHM meter...



I checked every fuse with a test light...they are all working....

6 months ago I had the head resurfaced and put in a new head gasket. I didnt have the front time chain cover resurfaced so when I put in the distributor it wouldnt seat and I accidently put a hairline 1 inch crack in the bottom half, right above the cam gear. I shaved the bottom of the cover and I put JB weld on the crack and its been running perfectly fine. I do not know anybody with a KADE so I cant swap it to check it?

FUEL....has it
Spark....has it
Air.....seems fine I pulled the intake off...

Im thinking distributor or ECU?

ANY SUGGESTIONS WOULD BE APPRECIATED....

[negrosx13]

are the injectors getting signal?

[davirene]

The Injectors all lit up the test light...but I do not have an OHM meter...

[Zero-Offset]

didn't see you mention if you checked the MAF.
another good place to start since its simple to clean and check if there is a bad connection.

[negrosx13]

car should start without maf..My car does

[nismoracingsx]

MAF won't keep the car from starting, it would just run like shizz
Could always pick up another distributor and if it doesn't fix it just return it..

[FaLKoN240]

You should try an ECU first. That's like the cheapest and easiest thing to check. Instead of wasting money replacing the head gasket and shit.

[Motoskin]

fuel pump?

[FaLKoN240]

Don't even bother with the pump. Check the ECU first.

[davirene]

Well a friend said it might of skipped a tooth....so I put the motor at TDC...and checked the ailignment...it looks dead on??

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14/davirene/KADEcams.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14/davirene/jimwolf.jpg



My Fuel pump...is humming like normal....and plenty of fuel is shooting out of the line...
I did spray starting fluid in....and it kicked for a second then died.... so I pulled my fuel line right above the fuel filterhttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/mag-glass_10x10.gif (http://zilvia.net/f/tech-talk/344669-need-some-insight-im-stumped-my-car-wont-start.html#) and that shot fuel out. Now when I spray in starting fluid it doesnt do anything.....

[Mishkin_707]

check the engine control fuse under the hood.

[orion::S14]

I can pretty much guarantee that it didn't skip a tooth...never before seen a legit, CONFIRMED case of a KA out of time due to "skipping a tooth". Lots of conjecture, and speculation (My shitty KA skipped a tooth, so I put in an SR, dawG...!)...but never actually seen it.

That said, EGI fuse is a good call...and so is the MAF (unplug it, and try to start the car - See if the revs are limited to ~2000).

- Brian

[KrazyS13]

Have you tried putting the ecu in self diagnostic mode and checking for codes? Such an easy thing to do yet so many people over look this simple procedure that can be very affective.

I have a feeling you need to look back at your injectors though...Your plugs should not be "wet with fuel". Pull the rail/injectors up off manifold, unplug the injector connector from each one and pressurize the fuel system, then wait a few minutes and see if you have any leaks from them. If you have the slightest leak, the injector is bad and needs to be replaced. Could be the o-ring leaking so check that closely.

[g35gabby]

You sure that Optima is good. No red top is rated at 1000CKA(least that I remember, think they are closer to 720)........ My fiance has going through 1/2 douzen of them and cooks them about every 18 months like clock work.

air/fuel/ igntion........ the car will run assuming you have all 3. You have to be missing 1.

MAF would be a likely suspect as well as an issue with your dizzy.

[davirene]

Thanks to everybody for the tips.....but im still stumped??

So I picked up another ECU and Distributor.....and DITTO.....NADA.....waisted money....

The Red TOP.... No red top is rated at 1000CKA
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14/davirene/crankinamps.jpg

So im no battery expert....but CA is 1000 and CCA is 800

As for the injectors....I had to replace one of them about 3 months ago.....so when I pulled the rail...I put on all new O rings....via rebuild kits....but even with bad injectors....shouldnt the car start for at least a second when I put the starting fluid in??? Ive been completely out of gas and cranked a different car while spraying directly into the intake and had the car kick start and run???

Just to clarify again....I have plenty of cranking power....I have plenty of spark from the coil and the wires....I have fuel shooting out of the line right after the fuel filter....the car sounds like it has good compression.....

So tomorrow im going to borrow a friends compression tester....and go from there....its kind of hard to work on cause i work 10hrs a day....

[KrazyS13]

If your injectors are leaking bad enough, they can produce way too MUCH fuel and will cause your stong spark to be completely inaffective. I just finished chasing down 3 bad injectors over a period of a couple of months, I wouldn't rule them out so easily(the redtop injectors are known to be very problematic).

Do the test... It's simple, free, quick and might be your answer.

[OBEEWON]

Have you checked your MAF as suggested. It's possible after it died you flooded the engine trying to restart it.

[davirene]

Update......Im f#@KD

So I did the compression check and its pretty ugly.....

Cyl 1. 100psi
Cyl 2. 90psi
Cyl 3. 60psi
Cyl 4. 55psi

So I reset my timing twice thinking my cams were off causing poor compression...buy once again nothing....it reads the same....

I have had a motor go out before (different car) and gradually it got worse and worse....but I never had a really strong pulling, great running car just die. Maybe I had a massive head gasket failure??? The head was resurfaced and a new gasket and ARP head studs were installed.

If anybody has an extra motor lying around....let me know....thanks

[KaminaSan]

That sounds fishy to me. You obviously didn't do the compression test correctly.

Was the pedal down? You obviously hadn't warmed the car up. My ka24e(when I had a leaky intake manifold gasket(baaaaad vacuum leak) read 150/154/125/79

And then I got the intake leak fixed, and opened the throttle. 150 across the board.

If this is really the case...
I do happen to have a ka24de from a 92 that I have sitting in my friends garage. Clutch is worn on it, but it had 165 across the board before I pulled it out. If you really are blown. Let me know. Shoot me a decent price, and I'll hook you up. Even have the cherry picker still attached to it.

[SinGarage]

Even with a bad compression the engine should still start. I had 2 cylinders with holes on the side of the block with no pistons and still ran. Ofcourse like shit but still ran.

From your description, I would also put my money on a leaky injector or 2 since the plugs was really wet. GL.

[davirene]

LOL.....You obviously hadn't warmed the car up. Come on bro...the car wont start at all....so how would it get warm?

kaminasan As for shooting a decent price for your KADE...well I am pretty low on funds.....Why dont you throw me a number....I am probably gonna just pull mine and rebuild the bottom end....

I would also put my money on a leaky injector or 2 since the plugs was really wet After letting the car sit a day and all the spark plugs removed....I disconnected the injectors and cranked it.....still nothing..... So I sprayed the starting fluid in again directly into the intaked and its the same....

Just so I can isolate whats bad....im going to do a LEAK DOWN test tomorrow....

[g35gabby]

Thanks to everybody for the tips.....but im still stumped??

So I picked up another ECU and Distributor.....and DITTO.....NADA.....waisted money....

The Red TOP....
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14/davirene/crankinamps.jpg

So im no battery expert....but CA is 1000 and CCA is 800



CCA(assuming that is what you meant for CKA) is 800. maybe I miss understood you.....

[axlegrease]

Pull your plugs out and let the car sit overnight, it could be that the cylinders got washed down with fuel and the rings aren't sealing like they should, hence the shitty compression numbers. Also, did you try a wet compression test afterwards? I'm almost willing to bet that its a leaky injector like previously said.

[KrazyS13]

The injector test you performed would not tell you shit.. Stop being lazy and do the test exactly like I said, its not hard!!!

[axlegrease]

^yes, do it. It'll be better than spending whatever money ka's go for these days and later finding out it was something small and simple, which in all honesty, is what this sounds like.

[torque88]

did you gap your spark plugs when you changed them?

[davirene]

The injector test you performed would not tell you shit.. Stop being lazy and do the test exactly like I said, its not hard!!!

There is nothing wrong with the injectors.....I did the leak down test ....so I have a blown head gasket....between #3 and #4 Cylinders......Same spot as before.....I had the head machined but not the block....

I believe I have a low spot on the block so I will have to get that machined....Just kind a hard to pull the motor when Im working 2 weeks straight...

The leak down test is pretty awesome.....