This is the roll center, suspension pickup, and steering angle modification thread.

[PoorMans180SX]

Originally Posted by Def

More than a few people have measured the S13 and S14 FLCA and found them to be the same length. I think the track difference might come from the front subframe. It's the same way in the rear.

Wait, is it just me, or am I victim to the most widespread misinformation in the S-chassis community? Or I'm much more of a newb than I thought?

Dang neiko, that sucks. I wouldn't have thought of that either. Unfortunately the post is so old that I can't edit it anymore?

[Aussie Drifter]

Hi Guys

I have been doing some work on using non-Nissan knuckles as a bolt on kit for the Silvia.

With this kit I hope to achieve:

• Infinite Height adjustability
• Infinite Roll Centre Adjustability
• Close to 0° Ackerman (For Drift Applications only) (Standard for Grip Racing)
• Use of R32, R33, R34 brakes (Also Working On Brembo 356mm Kit)
• 5 stud conversion
• Ability to use current Silvia coilovers
• Increased lock (A lot Of Lock)
• Adjustable LCA (Track / Camber)
• Adjustable Caster
• All joints will be fitted with Heim Joints
• Tie Rod Spacers For more Lock
• Rack Offset adaptors to eliminate Over centre Tie Rods

Also a 1UZ to Silvia Kit is in the near future! J

Once I have tested all of the components and am happy I will make a few sets so if anyone is interested please let me no.

I will release some more details once I have a few photos to show.

But please feel free to comment and ask questions.

Cheers
Adam
Missile Motorsport

[nieko]

That was an odd post.

but cool, i hope to see more!

[JeremyR]

Originally Posted by Def

More than a few people have measured the S13 and S14 FLCA and found them to be the same length. I think the track difference might come from the front subframe. It's the same way in the rear.

this can't be right, many people have done the swap with major increase in negative camber being the main highlight of this. i just put s14 lca on my car..i will double check with my s13 lca that i still have laying around


btw nieko please put up pics once your done modding the rack, and what you had to do to make the spacers work! i have a spare rack that im gonna have to modify if im going to run these.

[Aussie Drifter]

Yeah sorry for high jacking the thread with a random post that is off the current topic.

I am just chasing some input.

I will be using Toyota knuckels witch are of a much better design than the Nissan knuckel. I am also going to adapt these to my Commodore.

Cheers

[mmdb]

Originally Posted by Aussie Drifter

Yeah sorry for high jacking the thread with a random post that is off the current topic.

I am just chasing some input.

I will be using Toyota knuckels witch are of a much better design than the Nissan knuckel. I am also going to adapt these to my Commodore.

Cheers

Hey cool good news! Post up pix once they're done!

[!Zar!]

Sweet. Best of luck designing them.

I probably won't have the cash to throw down, but I'm sure whoever does will enjoy it.

As for the Driftworks spacers, that is quite annoying. Guess it is Dmax for me then.

[nieko]

Yeah its kinda weird that they dont have it posted on their site that it would only work for RHD.

oh well lol Pictures up hopefully tomorrow see if it all works.

[Pandapants]

Can someone explain this whole rhd rack thing? I thought they were the same as lhd, just for rhd cars. You'd think DW would mention some of the modifications needed to use the spacers (cut tie rods, rhd rack etc) like they did with the geomaster knuckles. Strikes me odd.

[nieko]

well if you think about it, they are not the exact same.

the steering column goes into the rack on the right side lol

the spacers would work fine but where the shaft slides into the rack is opposite on LHD compared to RHD.

look at the picture i posted of my rack and the picture on the first page.

the picture on the first page looks like my passenger side.

i feel like this post was quite confusing.

basically everything is flipped.

[nieko]

took me like 10 minutes to do the notching on both sides.

super easy, super straightfoward.

i also slanted them a LITTLE bit upwards hoping to correct a little bumpsteer.

was that a bad idea? lolol

[95KA-Turbo]

The motor went in today so I was able to get some proper measurements for some stuff.

Def had been asking for this - although I am adding misalignment spacers which are ~12.5mm on the top and ~8mm on the bottom, so I'll have another 4-6mm I can put a spacer in if need be.



I spaced it down a little bit to just show how many threads are left on the shank (keep in mind ~20.5mms of it will be eaten up with misalignment spacers. You can actually see the silver misalignment spacer I will be using on my outer tie rod in the background. Sorry this is such a bad picture, haha.




Ok on the ground...just under 23" from the fender to the ground.


If no one remembers, I cut the shit out of my fender frame rails to accommodate for how low I want to be.



~2 inches of space




The shank is not tight, so it is spaced down a tad more then it will be when I have everything bolted up, but you can get the idea (please ignore the terrible 'bump stop' that is sticking up on the LCA, that is not staying):



I am going to be putting my collar(s) back on top of my coilover mount to raise the car up 1/4 to 1/3 of an inch, because my oil pan clearance is a little scary...



I am spacing the motor mounts up a 1/2 inch to get the oil pan well above the subframe (it's equal to it now), so between doing that and raising the car 1/4 of an inch I'll get another 3/4" of clearance on the oil pan and I will build a gnarly ass skid plate!

[GripTerror]

nice .

[GSXRJJordan]

Coming together.

Which OEM oil pan is that aluminum one modeled after? GTO? I would have just changed the pan and pickup to keep the engine/trans as low as possible.

[95KA-Turbo]

That pan already uses a shortened GTO pick-up. It is dead even with the subframe right now, so I think moving it up 1/2 an inch will make it safer and shouldn't mess with the weight balance much.

This motor sits WAY lower then my SR did. I can only see the tip of throttle body when I'm sitting in the driver's seat with the hood off. On my SR I could see the entire valve cover and intake manifold easily.

[GSXRJJordan]

Originally Posted by 95KA-Turbo

That pan already uses a shortened GTO pick-up. It is dead even with the subframe right now, so I think moving it up 1/2 an inch will make it safer and shouldn't mess with the weight balance much.

This motor sits WAY lower then my SR did. I can only see the tip of throttle body when I'm sitting in the driver's seat with the hood off. On my SR I could see the entire valve cover and intake manifold easily.

Nice, I guess I'd have to see it. How's your trans to top-of-tunnel clearance? 1/2" isn't going to hurt you there?

I'm seriously stoked you're finally coming together. I bet you're excited as hell.

[95KA-Turbo]

Originally Posted by GSXRJJordan

Nice, I guess I'd have to see it. How's your trans to top-of-tunnel clearance? 1/2" isn't going to hurt you there?

I'm seriously stoked you're finally coming together. I bet you're excited as hell.

I have to check that out, but it's already been beaten out a little...I can just get a bigger hammer, LOL.


I'm definitely stoked! I wish I could get a harness from you...maybe I can do that after I get it running since cash flow is tight right now.

[Pandapants]

This kpi everyone is talking about, can it be adjusted by coilovers with cambers adjustments on the bottom brackets, e.g. dmax? I figured you could just set the top plates to full positive to make the strut a little more vertical and just use the bottom bracket for camber adjustment. Or does that not change the inclination?

[Def]

Yes, that will change it since it's the line from the top of the strut mount bearing/camber plate bearing to the balljoint. The thing with slotted coilover sleeves is it is a total PITA to get both sides the same and keep it there while torquing.

[Def]

Apple can blow sometimes

[Def]

Apple can blow sometimes

[GSXRJJordan]

Originally Posted by 95KA-Turbo

I have to check that out, but it's already been beaten out a little...I can just get a bigger hammer, LOL.

I'm definitely stoked! I wish I could get a harness from you...maybe I can do that after I get it running since cash flow is tight right now.

Awesome! I'm actually doing my LS1 harness right now, it was friiiiiiiiiiied. High mileage harnesses are absolute junk, wire falling out of connectors, etc. Using input from Stew (Jonny5) and Dai's FD S13 to make my cooling system a little more track-friendly, as well as putting together an affordable but baller oil cooler kit for LSx engines. Lots of LSx products to take all your moniez.

Originally Posted by Pandapants

This kpi everyone is talking about, can it be adjusted by coilovers with cambers adjustments on the bottom brackets, e.g. dmax? I figured you could just set the top plates to full positive to make the strut a little more vertical and just use the bottom bracket for camber adjustment. Or does that not change the inclination?

Yup, the Dmax coils (or any other lower adjusters that will actually hold the adjustment, not just slots in your circular ones) will let you adjust the "KPI".

[95KA-Turbo]

Haha, I was stoked because my Grex oil cooler I bought for my SR and never used threads right into the flanges on the Sikky pan - WOOT!

You should post some cooling stuff on SilviaV8 so we don't clutter this thread, I want to know everything!

[mmdb]

FOund these on Silviav8Forums.com. Looks like they're being copied and made in Russia now.



More pix here...

http://drift.ru/albert/prodrift_knuckles.pdf

[95KA-Turbo]

So that's 13.2 lbs for the pair? That's not terrible.


Are they getting custom spindle shank things (don't know what they're called) made or are they just cutting up stock spindles?

[SoSideways]

Originally Posted by Pandapants

This kpi everyone is talking about, can it be adjusted by coilovers with cambers adjustments on the bottom brackets, e.g. dmax? I figured you could just set the top plates to full positive to make the strut a little more vertical and just use the bottom bracket for camber adjustment. Or does that not change the inclination?

Except if you do that, the angle at the knuckle will become "too flat" at static ride height if you're really low, and the FLCA's spherical bearing/ball joint angle at that height will be much steeper than the knuckle's, causing binding.

To eliminate this, you either have to A) space the shit out of the FLCA to create a similar angle between the two, or B) lengthen the shit out of the FLCA so you can get the spherical bearing/ball joint in a sweet spot so that it will not bind when the knuckle rotates around.

To alleviate this problem, you have to either have a super high misalignment bearing mounted in a pretty open bearing cup that will allow for a shit ton of articulation, or a set of FLCAs that have a much less steep angle built into the bearing cups.

As a matter of fact, I meant to post a little update on my progress, and got sucked into replying about that post, so please pardon my double post, but my other post will not jive with this one, and it makes it easier for people to follow too....

Ready? GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

[SoSideways]

OK, a little update.

I took the bearing out and sort of sanded the bearing cup lip a bit up top where the spacer looked like it was hitting up front and in the back, and I also picked up these much thinner c-clips from ACE Hardware to replace the thick as hell GS ones.

Initial tests showed a little less binding, but I would still bind.

So I took the arm off and took the bearing back out, and switched to the routing bit for my dremel, after remembering I had a routing bit since I accidentally grabbed the wrong bit in the little storage compartment thingy on the carrying case.

This routing bit made short work of the metal this time around, and I was able to open up the bearing cup mount a little more in no time. I then used the sanding bit to clean it up to give it a nice smooth surface.

Went back and put everything back on and jacked the suspension back up to "normal ride height state" via my floor jack, and noticed the same binding at the same spot.

Took a look and saw there was light between the spacer and the bearing cup, and the washers weren't hitting the c-clip underneath. The nut on the camber plate up top wasn't hitting the bearing cup either.

So what was it?

It was this.





Basically, the spacer and the shims underneath were both hitting the bearing itself, since both have an O.D. of 1.00x".

I then used the routing bit on the spacer and was able to get a nice chamfer on it with relative ease. The hard part was not having a bench vice to clamp it down so I can really do some work to it. All I had was a pair of pliers to hold it with

I also took one of the shims that go on the bottom and used the routing bit on it. It didn't work so well since it kept grabbing too much and ended up bouncing all over the place, or it would move the shim on the pliers.

I ended up taking the reinforced cutting disc to it, and using that mofo on the shim was like using a kitana to cut watermelon. Again, the only issue with this one was that, I had to hold it using pliers, which made it impossible to really get a nice even cut all the way around.

I reckon that if I can take 2 of the shims and shave them down a hundredth of an inch down more to match what I've got going on for the spacer up top, that I'd be able to get a little more articulation out of that bearing before it binds again.

Also, just to see how much room I've got to work with, I laid the brake rotor up over the hub to see how much I have to shave off of the outside of the bearing cup and little reinforcement plate thing that's welded to the front of the arm, which goes almost all the way around the bearing cup. Looks like I'm only going to have to shave down like 2mm to 3mm before the rotor is no longer touching the FLCA in anyway, and I can probably take most of that reinforcement plate down in the middle and gain more room.

Another thought for me was to perhaps add a little more spacing between the FLCA and knuckle, as that would give me a little better angle between the 2, and possibly give me the last bit of articulation before binding up at the bearing again.

That or have someone make me a copy of these arms with a much less dramatic bend upwards at the bearing cup so that I would have no problems what so ever at static ride height and have miles of room to go in either compression or droop.

In any case, that's the progress thus far.

[95KA-Turbo]

You know what would be awesome. If you could get a rough angle measurement from your bearing. This way there can be a known angle that will NOT work, haha. I will get measurements on mine when I take the LCAs back off the car again.

[SoSideways]

Well, looking at this, I am thinking about maybe notching the spacer like this might help?



Or maybe enlarging the bore of the bearing cup a little more to fit this bad boy in there?

Part Number YPB12T, YPB-T and YPB-TG Series Spherical Bearings on QA1 Precision Products, Inc.

[GripTerror]

Originally Posted by mmdb

found these on silviav8forums.com. Looks like they're being copied and made in russia now.



more pix here...

http://drift.ru/albert/prodrift_knuckles.pdf

yea baby go mother russia woohoo!!!!! Are they 100% the same. I just checked the PDF... 600 bux for a group buy that's sick. That's 14.59lbs im guessing its in kilos (for both...) so that's like 7lbs each!

Man even though I'm not into drifting i see some bad ass stuff there LOL they got drift ladas yaaaa. I wish i understood russian lol: