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Tech Talk Technical Discussion About The Nissan 240SX and Nissan Z Cars


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Old 06-15-2012, 07:27 AM   #4261
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Guys, firewall @ work blocks page 143 because it "contains pr0n" . Is there a way you could remove the offending images / links / whatever ? Please
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Old 06-15-2012, 07:31 AM   #4262
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its only the word, ill edit it
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Old 06-15-2012, 07:35 AM   #4263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftmini View Post
well it depends if you want more camber or less camber. pointing in will give more camber, pointing out will give less camber
He's rotated the hat though... he's trying to adjust caster, not camber.
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Old 06-15-2012, 07:40 AM   #4264
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Originally Posted by Darren View Post
He's rotated the hat though... he's trying to adjust caster, not camber.
Yup. but he asked whether it should point in or out. both will give near enough same caster but camber will be dramatically different between the two

EDIT: like this vvvv
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Old 06-15-2012, 10:55 AM   #4265
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Thanks I figured it out. Now I wonder how much caster I could adjust with the top hats.
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Old 06-15-2012, 02:36 PM   #4266
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I got started with correcting my RC today:



With 40mm drop my rc goes from -175mm to -40, so to keep weight transfer in balance I need to swap out the front springs from 8 to 6 kg/mm

NB: picture is of my spare knuckle what I use for measurements and ideas, not finished piece

Also correct me if I'm wrong since my japanese is limited to engrish but this picture seems to show RC and COG height and anti-squat of standard 180SX

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Old 06-15-2012, 02:50 PM   #4267
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftmini View Post
Yup. but he asked whether it should point in or out. both will give near enough same caster but camber will be dramatically different between the two
Thanks for clearing that up, i wasn't trying to correct, merely trying to help out finding an answer
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Old 06-15-2012, 02:50 PM   #4268
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That is crazy. Looks a little ghetto, but hey if it works it works!


Got my alignment today. Everything went pretty smooth. I didn't really have to explain anything to the guy. Just a little on the IF inners.
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Old 06-15-2012, 09:22 PM   #4269
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How much rear toe-in is too much? Any amount?
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Old 06-16-2012, 02:26 AM   #4270
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Toe in makes it harder to slide. More stable on power though, but you need a lot of power to make it work. 0 Toe is usually good.
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Old 06-16-2012, 03:19 AM   #4271
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Toe in gives you forward bite and really drives the car forward.
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Old 06-16-2012, 03:23 AM   #4272
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motary View Post
I got started with correcting my RC today:



With 40mm drop my rc goes from -175mm to -40, so to keep weight transfer in balance I need to swap out the front springs from 8 to 6 kg/mm

NB: picture is of my spare knuckle what I use for measurements and ideas, not finished piece

Also correct me if I'm wrong since my japanese is limited to engrish but this picture seems to show RC and COG height and anti-squat of standard 180SX


Yes that pic does look like stock CofG and antisquat.

Are you altering the caster trail on your knuckles at all?

I took some measurements and roughly calculated my rc height ect, i came out with very similar results too you which is interesting.

With my calculations i figured i would need 100mm rc correction to get my rc 60mm above ground.

at the moment i just raised the front end to get the arms level.
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Old 06-16-2012, 03:37 AM   #4273
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Old 06-16-2012, 08:06 AM   #4274
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I am lowering the points straight down so caster trail does increase, which is a good thing meaning I can run less caster and have good self steer.

Who's setup is that on that last picture? it looks exactly what I want to do next year or so

Why do you want your RC to be 60mm above ground, thats even higher than in standard, it will certainly increase jacking. Wanting soft springs for daily driver use?
Wisefab setup appears to use rollcenter 0mm, very little caster if at all and no kpi either to avoid jacking at huge angles
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Old 06-16-2012, 08:22 AM   #4275
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I came in to this thread, to hopefully be able to understand and learned a bunch.

The last couple pages, have blown my mind... You guys get pretty wild.
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Old 06-16-2012, 09:52 AM   #4276
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Start with the first page. And read through it all its pretty magical. Haha
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Old 06-16-2012, 02:22 PM   #4277
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So today I went mad:





The steering pickup looks kinda weak compared to the rest so tomorrow I'll cut it off and convert steering pickup to double shear non-coned bolt connection
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Old 06-16-2012, 04:03 PM   #4278
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motary View Post
I am lowering the points straight down so caster trail does increase, which is a good thing meaning I can run less caster and have good self steer.

Who's setup is that on that last picture? it looks exactly what I want to do next year or so

Why do you want your RC to be 60mm above ground, thats even higher than in standard, it will certainly increase jacking. Wanting soft springs for daily driver use?
Wisefab setup appears to use rollcenter 0mm, very little caster if at all and no kpi either to avoid jacking at huge angles
double wishbone setup via facebook, josh coote i think. i think its an a 350z

mate i have no idea where i want my rc, that why iam just experimenting lol

my current setup by my calcs is +60mm rc with 10kg spring and no anti rollbar. +35mm each side on lower arms, 245 40 17 ad08s. with an rb25 upfront also. But i really like how the car drifts

maybe you can advise me on a better number to aim for
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Old 06-16-2012, 04:04 PM   #4279
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motary View Post
So today I went mad:





The steering pickup looks kinda weak compared to the rest so tomorrow I'll cut it off and convert steering pickup to double shear non-coned bolt connection
really awesome
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Old 06-16-2012, 05:15 PM   #4280
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Thanks! I would aim for 0, its good enough.
For our course work we had to move pickup points to get front rc height 50mm and rear 100mm, so perhaps thats a good one to try

Also use my calculator I made in that class for spring rate choice:
MS excel spring and arb calc
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Old 06-17-2012, 12:41 AM   #4281
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motary View Post
Thanks! I would aim for 0, its good enough.
For our course work we had to move pickup points to get front rc height 50mm and rear 100mm, so perhaps thats a good one to try

Also use my calculator I made in that class for spring rate choice:
MS excel spring and arb calc
Thanx for the spreadsheet.

There's no way the motion ratio for the front sway bar is 0.9 though..? More like 0.6 just by eye ball'n it.

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=240sx...NipyUCw&zoom=1
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Old 06-17-2012, 12:46 AM   #4282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motary View Post

There's no way that picture is accurate. The CG is not that far back, and those lines do not line up with the rear control arm attachement points at all.
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Old 06-17-2012, 03:23 AM   #4283
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That picture seems to depict anti squat of live rear axle then?

This could be more true:



My s13 in Susprog3D:



Note that the line from upper control arms is drawn from their virtual meeting point
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Old 06-18-2012, 04:19 AM   #4284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motary View Post
Thanks! I would aim for 0, its good enough.
For our course work we had to move pickup points to get front rc height 50mm and rear 100mm, so perhaps thats a good one to try

Also use my calculator I made in that class for spring rate choice:
MS excel spring and arb calc
Thanks man, much appreciated ill aim for 0mm rc height.

Its been posted a lot of times in this thread that rc should be a long way above ground and as close to cofg as poss. Might even say that in the first post :/

LOL
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Old 06-18-2012, 04:24 AM   #4285
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So today I went mad:





The steering pickup looks kinda weak compared to the rest so tomorrow I'll cut it off and convert steering pickup to double shear non-coned bolt connection
anymore progress on these?
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Old 06-18-2012, 05:48 AM   #4286
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I made a right side one too, but due to lack of time I didn't change the steering pickups, but they will be beefy
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Old 06-18-2012, 01:18 PM   #4287
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Quote:
Originally Posted by travypoo View Post
Here are the I30 vs the Teins.

What is the total length of the I30 inner tie rod? The Nissan X-trail ones I just bought are 20mm longer than s13 ones, but for my knuckle mod they are way too short, i have about 30mm toe out on both sides
I put the knuckles on the car today and the lock is epic, however not so with wheels mounted, they hit the chassis on leading side
The control arms have not been lengthened
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Old 06-18-2012, 01:51 PM   #4288
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What is the total length of the I30 inner tie rod? The Nissan X-trail ones I just bought are 20mm longer than s13 ones, but for my knuckle mod they are way too short, i have about 30mm toe out on both sides
I put the knuckles on the car today and the lock is epic, however not so with wheels mounted, they hit the chassis on leading side
The control arms have not been lengthened
Im in the same boat. I HAVE to run <205/45/16 so i don't hit the frame. Do you over center at all? I do, I was thinking about making some bump stops to get rid of the over centering and so i can run different tires up front.
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Old 06-18-2012, 02:19 PM   #4289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motary View Post
What is the total length of the I30 inner tie rod? The Nissan X-trail ones I just bought are 20mm longer than s13 ones, but for my knuckle mod they are way too short, i have about 30mm toe out on both sides
I put the knuckles on the car today and the lock is epic, however not so with wheels mounted, they hit the chassis on leading side
The control arms have not been lengthened
i30 ones are 35mm longer than s14 tie rods

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Old 06-18-2012, 02:40 PM   #4290
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What is this from? Details?

Any reason to use those knuckles over the z32/r32 style like MotoIQ has been doing on the old XS Engineering long a-arm setup?
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