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Old 08-06-2008, 12:50 PM   #391
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Something def not right I think it should be a lil more then that at 16psi.
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Old 08-06-2008, 09:54 PM   #392
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I used to have S3 cams on my old sentra with SR20DET. Does the JWT S3 cams drop right into the S13 SR20DET motors, or does the cams need to be modified a bit? specifically the dowel pin at the end of the cams. Did you have to get the JWT S3M cams?
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Old 08-06-2008, 09:59 PM   #393
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Quote:
Originally Posted by purekoryo View Post
I used to have S3 cams on my old sentra with SR20DET. Does the JWT S3 cams drop right into the S13 SR20DET motors, or does the cams need to be modified a bit? specifically the dowel pin at the end of the cams.
I think the exhaust cam dowel pin needs to be longer ??

CAll Ben and JWT and ask him !!
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Old 08-13-2008, 07:55 PM   #394
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I posted a previous thread with my first dyno pull with minor bolt ons: AFC NEO, Exhaust, and fmic Dynoed at 203 hp with 198ft lbs of torque

After obtaining some new parts:

Megan Elbow
Garrett 2871r .64 w/HKS actuator
Power FC D-Jetro
Tomei 740cc injectors
Nismo FPR
Walboro 255lph fuel pump

I managed to pull out 284 hp with 14lbs of boost (no boost controller)
I forgot what the torque was but ill post a pic of my dyno sheet later today.

LMK what u guys think... by the way its still on stock internals with stock headgasket.
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Old 08-15-2008, 04:10 PM   #395
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I have decided on the JWT S4 Cams. I will install the following this Sunday.

GT2871r .64
JWT S4 Cams
740cc Nismo Injectors
Z32 MAF
Enthalpy ECU
Megan O2 housing with ebay 3" turboback exhaust

Does anyone have the same setup or have run S4's previously? From what I hear from sr20forums, S4's kick some ass. I've had S3 on my sentra B14 before with the GT2871r but with .86 housing, so that had some bit of lag. I wonder how much decrease in lag I will notice even with the S4's.
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Old 08-15-2008, 06:23 PM   #396
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damn, you got it backwards TWICE.

.64 trim = s3 cams
.86 trim = s4 cams
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Old 08-16-2008, 06:14 AM   #397
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Have you tried both setups? You act like you did, and if you did and thought it was pretty bad, than that's great, I know now. But if you didn't I wouldn't say anything if I were you. At least I'm gonna try and see how that works out, as many people that do have JWT cams here go with S3's. As a matter of fact, many MANY sentra guys have sold S3's and bought S4's and never turned back. used S4's are hard to come by in sr20forum, but not S3's. As codyace mentioned they are easier to catch, and even used S4's are a bit more expensive than S3's for a reason. Many guys with the sentras run S4's in conjunction with T25 and T28 turbos all day. The guys with the T28's did not have any noticeable loss in power or lag with S4's.

So, again, have you tried those two combinations, if so, back it up with some details on your experience with them so that we can all learn. If not, you can learn from my experience, as I will post them after I install them.

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Originally Posted by usdm180sx View Post
damn, you got it backwards TWICE.

.64 trim = s3 cams
.86 trim = s4 cams
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Old 08-16-2008, 09:04 AM   #398
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The powerband for the .64 and s3 cams are both mid range. The powerband for the .86 and s4 cams are for more top end. Your setup will work, but it's not optimal. I had the HKS GT-RS (basically the .64) on an s14 sr (w/nvcs) and ran HKS 256/264 cams (more mid range). Here's a dyno chart documenting my "experience:"

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Old 08-16-2008, 09:58 AM   #399
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so the consensus is basically that the .86ar sucks?

Damn, I was just about to buy one
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Old 08-16-2008, 12:48 PM   #400
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i dont think the .86a/r sucks at all!! I loved mine and would actually consider doing another one. buy the .86a/r b/c you'll want the extra power after you get used to the .64A/R. just my opinion
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Old 08-17-2008, 05:57 PM   #401
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Just got the .64 installed. Wow it spools up much quicker than the .86 I had. I will install the jwt s4 cams next weekend and post the experience and then I may get it dynoed.
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Old 08-18-2008, 01:15 PM   #402
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only buy the .86 if you want to make power and go fast!!!!lol
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Old 08-18-2008, 03:45 PM   #403
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i can post my dyno sheet when i get a chance. I recently installed the .64 on my redtop. Liking it so far. Problem was that while he was trying to dyno it he could only get it to hold stable boost at around 14lbs. Anything higher and it would spike above 20. I was having him shoot for 17 psi when tuning it but ended up tuning it for 14. I just used the standard wastegate when i installed it, i figured my blitz spcid would handle the rest. I see alot of people using the HKS actuater though even if they have an ebc. would its adjustability help me with spiking issues?
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Old 08-18-2008, 04:19 PM   #404
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjabread View Post
so the consensus is basically that the .86ar sucks?

Damn, I was just about to buy one
No, just figure out what you want more - topend or midrange

In my case I had the Full Race turbo manifold and my .86ar spooled more like a .64 so I got the best of both worlds.

"Good" or "best" are relative terms in this sort of decision. Are you going to drift? Autocross? Street daily driven? Drag or highway race?

I drove my car 95% street and 5% drag, so I went to the .86ar but used cams with better mid range to create a combo that I was really happy with.
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Old 08-18-2008, 05:31 PM   #405
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WA_Sileighty View Post
i can post my dyno sheet when i get a chance. I recently installed the .64 on my redtop. Liking it so far. Problem was that while he was trying to dyno it he could only get it to hold stable boost at around 14lbs. Anything higher and it would spike above 20. I was having him shoot for 17 psi when tuning it but ended up tuning it for 14. I just used the standard wastegate when i installed it, i figured my blitz spcid would handle the rest. I see alot of people using the HKS actuater though even if they have an ebc. would its adjustability help me with spiking issues?
I had the same issues with my GT-RS which is exactly like the .64 with an HKS actuator. Max boost before spiking was 16.9lbs. I had the Blitz i-color boost controller as well. We couldn't figure it out so we left it at 16.9lbs. but it was still fast and really fun.
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Old 08-18-2008, 05:39 PM   #406
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you guys need to get an avc-r it holds 10 psi 14ps 16 psi 20 psi very stable
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Old 08-18-2008, 05:52 PM   #407
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wondering if possibly the wastegate arm is too tight, worth a try i suppose. sure is more fun to drive now, need cams and more boost though :-)
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Old 08-18-2008, 06:15 PM   #408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anyotherone View Post
No, just figure out what you want more - topend or midrange

In my case I had the Full Race turbo manifold and my .86ar spooled more like a .64 so I got the best of both worlds.

"Good" or "best" are relative terms in this sort of decision. Are you going to drift? Autocross? Street daily driven? Drag or highway race?

I drove my car 95% street and 5% drag, so I went to the .86ar but used cams with better mid range to create a combo that I was really happy with.

I drift my car and daily it, but I dont really care how it is on the street.

Right now I have hks 264 step 2, and I think they would be a good match with the .86. I thought of also keeping the stock cast manifold, because it doesnt crack, and I heard it helps spool a tiny bit.

We'll see, whatever I buy its going to happen over the winter.
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Old 08-18-2008, 11:09 PM   #409
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Finally got my S14 tuned right and making power. I am running the following mods:

GT2871R .64 /HKS actuator
1.1 Apexi HG
264 BC cams
BC Valve springs/retainers
Megan mainfold
Megan turbo elbow
Megan downpipe
Megan test pipe
Uras 3" exhaust
Greddy FMIC
NO BOV
Apexi PFC
740cc
Sard FPR
Greddy E01

At 1.1 bar my car was putting down 330hp/301tq.
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Old 08-18-2008, 11:12 PM   #410
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were those stage 1 or stage 2 cams..also, what dyno?
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Old 08-19-2008, 07:48 AM   #411
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inlandsilvia View Post
Finally got my S14 tuned right and making power. I am running the following mods:

GT2871R .64 /HKS actuator
1.1 Apexi HG
264 BC cams
BC Valve springs/retainers
......................................

At 1.1 bar my car was putting down 330hp/301tq.
S14 or S13 SR20 engine ?
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Old 08-19-2008, 06:22 PM   #412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by purekoryo View Post
I used to have S3 cams on my old sentra with SR20DET. Does the JWT S3 cams drop right into the S13 SR20DET motors, or does the cams need to be modified a bit? specifically the dowel pin at the end of the cams. Did you have to get the JWT S3M cams?
You don't need the longer dowell pin at all for it to work as it should.

BE careful with the M cams, as they IIRC are for the GTiR solid valvetrain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by usdm180sx View Post
damn, you got it backwards TWICE.

.64 trim = s3 cams
.86 trim = s4 cams
That's my look at things too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by purekoryo View Post
Have you tried both setups? You act like you did, and if you did and thought it was pretty bad, than that's great, I know now. But if you didn't I wouldn't say anything if I were you. At least I'm gonna try and see how that works out, as many people that do have JWT cams here go with S3's. As a matter of fact, many MANY sentra guys have sold S3's and bought S4's and never turned back. used S4's are hard to come by in sr20forum, but not S3's. As codyace mentioned they are easier to catch, and even used S4's are a bit more expensive than S3's for a reason. Many guys with the sentras run S4's in conjunction with T25 and T28 turbos all day. The guys with the T28's did not have any noticeable loss in power or lag with S4's.
The main thing i look at with t25/t28 guys, is that they typically aren't making enough power to really show the difference between the two. That, combined with lightning fast small turbo spool, also sorta/kinda leave it up to debate for me.

FWIW: There are a few Japanese tuners that swear by running smaller based turbos with BIG duration (we're talking 266-272) cams and seeing some interesting power (first example is the Mines car, as well as some of the Evo Time Attack cars we see in the JDMyo! kinda videos). Obviously it's hard to compare a little inline 4 to a a little inline 6, but it would be neat to see a side by side comparison from persay, the S3 camshaft to the s4, or to somethign like a 272 duration cam.

Experience says that the larger duration cams will increase spool, but it would be neat to see by how much with the 2871 turbocharger.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjabread View Post
so the consensus is basically that the .86ar sucks?

Damn, I was just about to buy one
It doesn't 'suck', it's just that (IMO) there are better routes to take. For those that argue 'you'll want the extra 20 whp'....no freaking way. 20 hp isn't even getting your toes wet in the pool. I say, if you want 400 whp, get the .64 housing...anything more, look ta a 3071/3076 variant.


Quote:
Originally Posted by anyotherone View Post
No, just figure out what you want more - topend or midrange

In my case I had the Full Race turbo manifold and my .86ar spooled more like a .64 so I got the best of both worlds.
The tubular manifold typically spools smalelr turbos later, due to design, and lack of heat retention.

Quote:
"Good" or "best" are relative terms in this sort of decision. Are you going to drift? Autocross? Street daily driven? Drag or highway race?

I drove my car 95% street and 5% drag, so I went to the .86ar but used cams with better mid range to create a combo that I was really happy with.
This is the ebst way to look at things. I laugh at people that build 'drag' or 'drift' or 'grip' cars, and then take it their respective events twice a year, and are forced to drive a finnicky quasi-race car around the rest of the time. This is exactly why I went with the combo I did. It's perfect for a street car, and just so happens to work awesome on the road course. Don't get me wrong, I know where i could take away/add form the setup, but it's not worth the small changes to sacrifice it's street manners.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inlandsilvia View Post
Finally got my S14 tuned right and making power. I am running the following mods:

GT2871R .64 /HKS actuator
1.1 Apexi HG
264 BC cams
BC Valve springs/retainers
Megan mainfold
Megan turbo elbow
Megan downpipe
Megan test pipe
Uras 3" exhaust
Greddy FMIC
NO BOV
Apexi PFC
740cc
Sard FPR
Greddy E01

At 1.1 bar my car was putting down 330hp/301tq.
So arond 16 psi...you should be seeing more in the 350/360 range if you were on a dynojet dyno.
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Old 08-19-2008, 06:55 PM   #413
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You MUST match cam duration/or power band effectiveness to the compressor you are using.

If you are say using a T67/T3 that spools up full boost at 5300 rpms then 264 cams are a terrible camshaft to be using. You should be using at least 272 cam durations with a relatively aggressive lift.


If you are using a .86 2871R for example. I would suggest a duration of 264-266

For 2871R .64 I would say a 260 Tomei cam would do the trick just right.


Matching cams to the turbo can make or break how aggressive the on power is.

You cannot fight the turbo. The turbo will want to make power about 1000 rpms after you get full spool on your turbo on sr20s (and a lot of other smaller 4 cylinder engines with similar heads).

I would suggest going with the flow.


If you have a GT30R for example lots of lift and moderate duration

If you have a 2871R for example moderate lift and moderate duration

If you have a GT35R for example aggressive lift and aggressive duration

If you have a GT4088R for example aggressive lift and very aggressive dur.

and so on and so on.

This is all proven over the last 1-2 years of using the dyno dynamics I have with various different sr20det setups and cam combinations.
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Old 08-20-2008, 03:37 AM   #414
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You don't need the longer dowell pin at all for it to work as it should.

BE careful with the M cams, as they IIRC are for the GTiR solid valvetrain.



That's my look at things too.



The main thing i look at with t25/t28 guys, is that they typically aren't making enough power to really show the difference between the two. That, combined with lightning fast small turbo spool, also sorta/kinda leave it up to debate for me.

FWIW: There are a few Japanese tuners that swear by running smaller based turbos with BIG duration (we're talking 266-272) cams and seeing some interesting power (first example is the Mines car, as well as some of the Evo Time Attack cars we see in the JDMyo! kinda videos). Obviously it's hard to compare a little inline 4 to a a little inline 6, but it would be neat to see a side by side comparison from persay, the S3 camshaft to the s4, or to somethign like a 272 duration cam.

Experience says that the larger duration cams will increase spool, but it would be neat to see by how much with the 2871 turbocharger.




It doesn't 'suck', it's just that (IMO) there are better routes to take. For those that argue 'you'll want the extra 20 whp'....no freaking way. 20 hp isn't even getting your toes wet in the pool. I say, if you want 400 whp, get the .64 housing...anything more, look ta a 3071/3076 variant.




The tubular manifold typically spools smalelr turbos later, due to design, and lack of heat retention.



This is the ebst way to look at things. I laugh at people that build 'drag' or 'drift' or 'grip' cars, and then take it their respective events twice a year, and are forced to drive a finnicky quasi-race car around the rest of the time. This is exactly why I went with the combo I did. It's perfect for a street car, and just so happens to work awesome on the road course. Don't get me wrong, I know where i could take away/add form the setup, but it's not worth the small changes to sacrifice it's street manners.



So arond 16 psi...you should be seeing more in the 350/360 range if you were on a dynojet dyno.


??? But you wanted to get C1's, that really contradicts your statement. Eitherway, I will post my experience with the S4's once its installed. Unfortunately I dont have back to back dyno results, but I did have a GT2871r .86 with S3 cams before and the spool was pretty bad. So far the GT2871r with .64 housing spools really nicely.
SCC did some comparisions of the JWT cams...



scc cam comparo link (please make this a sticky!) - Page 2 - SR20 Forum
NEW JWT S4 SCC REVIEW - SR20 Forum

S4 cams really does not lose much if any low end, just gains more midrange and high end than the S3's.

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Old 08-24-2008, 02:50 PM   #415
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Just installed the S4's....
THIS CAR IS CRAZY!!!
I NEED WIDER TIRES!!!

I did not notice any low end loss, the mid range to top end is unbelievable. The S4's are a bit better than the S3's even with a small turbo GT2871r .64. I can see why sentra guys even install these on the T25's and T28's. I will take the car to the dyno next chance i get, but for now I definitely need some wider tires as I will just sit there in 2nd gear after 3-4krpm's. 3rd pull on the highway was too dangerous on stock tires.

Mind you that this was all on 15 psi. After I get some Azenis 245's in the rear and 225 in the front, I will turn it up to about 19 psi.
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Old 08-25-2008, 02:10 AM   #416
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Originally Posted by purekoryo View Post
Just installed the S4's....
THIS CAR IS CRAZY!!!
I NEED WIDER TIRES!!!

I did not notice any low end loss, the mid range to top end is unbelievable. The S4's are a bit better than the S3's even with a small turbo GT2871r .64. I can see why sentra guys even install these on the T25's and T28's. I will take the car to the dyno next chance i get, but for now I definitely need some wider tires as I will just sit there in 2nd gear after 3-4krpm's. 3rd pull on the highway was too dangerous on stock tires.

Mind you that this was all on 15 psi. After I get some Azenis 245's in the rear and 225 in the front, I will turn it up to about 19 psi.
Sounds sick!!!
post up dyno!!! now!!!
but then again.. stock tires....
I have 10.5 inch rears running 245's and i spin tires in third and fourth on fwy if i boost above 18psi. my tires are sorta worn, but still wide.. so I am dying to know your results, since i am very close to ordering my own set!
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Old 08-25-2008, 06:40 PM   #417
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So arond 16 psi...you should be seeing more in the 350/360 range if you were on a dynojet dyno.
I think INLANDS #s are on a dynojet or hub dyno, so it would be lower on a Brake eddy Chassis dyno.
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Old 08-25-2008, 06:51 PM   #418
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.86 gt2871r + 272/272 cams = worst mistake of my life
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Old 08-25-2008, 09:18 PM   #419
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Refer to my post above
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Old 08-25-2008, 11:03 PM   #420
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so would it be better with hks 264 step 2s lol
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