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Old 09-20-2005, 09:12 AM   #1
WhiteGLX
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Road Race setup/ Track pics

This is one of many past track days in preparation for SRX in the not-so-distant future.

If anyone has anyadvice for a track setup with an S13, advice is welcome, but please dont come on here and tell me how to drive and that there is one way to setup a racecar. I have been researching the setup, talked to many true race car drivers and builders at the tracks and shops. I knwo what i want and i know what i need to put all the power down. But for now, these are just some fun pics :-D

view with non-race wheels on


front shot


My oil cooler off of a small Piper aircraft (4x4x6 bisches)


Nice rear shot


Switch Panel and Gauges


Dirty Interior


My setup may not have the best suspension, or a ton of power, but i can deff. say its got enough power and good enough handling on the road course to make me happy, and to keep away from the mildly modded Evo's

I rewired the entire car to a Painless Switch panel, eliminating what seemed like 40lbs of wiring. I gutted the entire interior of the car (except the tar sh#t). I removed all the PS elements, and put in a breather system to keep the rack lubricated. A catch can was installed instead of the tiny filter most use. The car is setup for reliability, and ease of repair. Racing puts alot more abuse on an engine than any other kind of driving, because its so prolonged.
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Old 09-20-2005, 09:15 AM   #2
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Dirty Interior


Back seat & Battery


S14 seats, and Manual seat belts (note the "oh [censored]!" handle)


Fuel Pump wiring & Battery


Engine bay...something is missing?


What fuse box??


What Relay box?


What Power steering pump?


OH!!!! Thats the sandwich plate...i had it all wrong before


nice lil side shot


Stickers me thinks


Interior shot...again


Leave comments here, track pics will be up soon. Suggestions are welcome, although not always takin . This car has been to VIR, Mid-Ohio, Summit point, and soon to have driven Beaverun raceway labor day weekend. Each event i get a lil faster, each event i get a lil more confident pushing the car harder, each event.....i wish i had wider wheels than the 300zx rims with Falken Azenis i run now.
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Old 09-20-2005, 09:16 AM   #3
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FINALLY TRACK PICS FROM BEAVERUN!!!!!

ENJOY!!!!!!





















also rebuild pics will be up eventually, as soon as my parts begine to show up....just basic new seals and rings, but alot of aviation engineering put to use on reassemly of this road course engine.....track abuse has rattled stuff loose over time, but not anymore once im all done with it.
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Old 09-20-2005, 10:09 AM   #4
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awesome project. i assume you know this, but just in case, aren't you supposed to have the headlight cover on there to compete in srx? what do you plan to do about that?
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Old 09-20-2005, 11:55 AM   #5
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one suggestion that i give a lot of people w. gutted interiors would be to put some padding on the drivers door where your arm may hit bare metal in an accident. i learned the hard way at Sears Point when i got pushed off track during a race and my arm banged up against the door. got the scar as a daily reminder.

in regards to setup. (i know you already know this) it all depends on your suspension/tire selection, drivers taste/style, track and track conditions. there's just too many variables to just throw out a setup. just set the ride height (corner weights) and camber/toe settings to something very neutral and adjust to your liking. i'm sure you know what you're doing on track and will know if the car is handling evil.

good luck. avoid the red mist. and remember at the end of the day it's all about having fun and being able to drive home.
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Old 09-20-2005, 02:21 PM   #6
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My setup is all based on my lack of funds for now...

but my future setup over time will consist of:
*suspension - Buddy Club Race Spec Dampners
*Wheels - 5-Zigen FNO1RC 17x10
*Tires - Toyo RA1 275/45R17
*Power - 370whp at 16psi (not going to let out my power setup tho)
*6pnt cage - weld in custom fitted to me
*interior - Sparce EVO2 seats, all mechanical/electrical gauges. (no stock)

And as for the headlight..Ill be putting the cover back on eventually, as soon as i can switch to the DOHC front bumper with a nice lip, so i have somewhere else ot put my oilcooler (passenger side behind vent). all ducted prettiness off those vents and turns signal locations. The oil cooler will have a scoop going to it after the winter season, as a temporary thing but fully function to bring my oil temp number downa lil bit.

I have read the rule books for SE-R SRX, NASA CCR quite a bit, but for now, HPDE's will be my main priority until i get to the competition level. We all know, nothing can replace seat time, plus i need to progress with my car slowly, as of now im outdriving my suspension and tires, so i upgrade tires now, adn suspensioin and wheels when i can afford them. Being a full tiem college student going for a bachelors degree, fundign this expensive hobby is much harder then most think, 21 credits per semester puts a nice lil dent in your funds.

Thanks for the questions guys and the advice, btw...the doors are covered now, with aluminum falshing. Kepp all questions and comments comming, ill answer everything to the bets of my ability.
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Old 09-20-2005, 02:46 PM   #7
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I have a question for you. Which Painless wiring kit did you get and how long did it take you to wire it up? I'm having some wiring problems right now with my car and I'm seriously considering picking up one of those kits so I can fix it, and to get rid of the fuse boxes and excess wiring. I have a base model s13 as well and my headlights are welded up so I don't have to worry about having a function for the headlight motors.
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Old 09-20-2005, 03:56 PM   #8
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i picked it out of a catalog at an A&A automotive here at school, a guy there gave me a discount. Its a 6 switch panel, 1 momentary start switch, the other 5 switches are fused. The fuel pump fuse is wired to the ignition switch, so you can run the fuel pump with the ignition off. The actual part number im not sure of. Its a panel for a drag car basically, or a Universal setup.

Time spent.....wow......i actually couldnt say, i spent a rediculous amount of time stripping the stock chasis harnmess down to just the fuel pump/gauge and brake light wires. And even more time designing the circuits that i used for Starter, Ignition, Alternator. I had to read over all the gauge cluster BS wiring diagrams extensivly to findout which wires i had to keep to keep them runnign andlit up, but get rid of all the stupid warning lights in there. Mostly it was time spent tracing wires through the factory harness, strippin git down to nothing and reading almost all the wiring diagrams for the systems i wanted to keep or wire in. Overall time was about.....2 weeks or more while having a full time job.
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Old 09-20-2005, 04:23 PM   #9
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I was under the impression you bought a painless wiring kit that comes with all the wires and fuse boxes as well as having that switch panel. Where did you put the stock fuse boxes and relays?
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Old 09-20-2005, 06:47 PM   #10
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"Where did you put the stock fuse boxes and relays?"
In the garbage where they belong

1 fuse for ignition (ECU power)
1 fuse for fuel pump
1 relay for fuel pump

thats all of it.....and the 2 fuses are on the switch panel, just like in the picture, and the fuel pump relay is in the trunk.

i have no stock funtions, no blinkers, no headlights, to back up lights, no radio, no retractable seat belts, no horns, no fans, no AC, no defrost, no more anythign, car had absolutly no wiring in it for about 2 weeks till i finished making my own harness

the painles s kit is a switch panels with 18' of labeled wire comming out of it for each of the switchs functions or what ever you want them to do. I integrated that with some of the stock wiring and everything works great, its been runing electrical problem free since June
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Old 09-20-2005, 09:44 PM   #11
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impressive. I'm about 20% done with doing almost the same thing, well a bit more lax. I'm just taking out interior wiring and such, but I make up for the weightloss in other places. Gutted doors (metal is cut out), no windows (i have 2 sets of doors), removed the tar, no dash, no ceter console, no carpet at all, no passenger seat. The shit I've taken out of this car is rediculious. I would venture to guess that its sub 2200 range. I still need to get it weighed. I lost somewhere near 40lbs a door with the metal, motors, and glass. Fuckin great! Good work man!
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Old 09-20-2005, 10:03 PM   #12
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my car with it down to how it is now..weighed in at 2400 lbs ona 1/4 tank of gas, I know the door metal weighs a bit, and so does the tar, but i can honestly say i dont see these cars getting under 2300 lbs. I know i can get down close to that, after i remove the tar, go carbon fiber hood, take out my heating systems that doesnt work anymore, and gut the doors. Then the cage im getting will bring me back up to 2400lbs, and i wont see weights less then that. There are people who claim to be under 2200, unless you have staretd cutting metal from inside the car and running it ghetto as all hell, it just cant happen, keep it clean and functional and safe while also making it light.

My car was weighed on Longacher scales at Beaverun 2 weeks ago (FR-750lbs, FL-750lbs, RR-450lbs, RL 450lbs), my corner weights arnt exact, but to the best of my knowledge that was the weight bias. Truck stops dont count as scales, very inaccurate with low weights (like a car compared to a tractor-trailor full of shit)...
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Old 09-20-2005, 11:12 PM   #13
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That oil cooler can't be doing much. If you need an oil cooler, an upgrade is in order because honestly that one won't cut it. You'll also have to locate it in an area that sees more airflow through the cooling surface.

I don't see anything really wrong with your battery placement, but it's a bit high. Other than that, it's over the axle so it doesn't really increase polar moment and it certainly helps f/r and l/r weight distribution. Since the car seems to be a purpose-built track car, why not put the battery lower, like in the passenger side rear footwell? That way your polar moment is decreased by a pretty hefty amount, not to mention your cG will go down a bit. You'll lose a little bit by way of rearward weight bias percentage but the l/r advantage will stay the same.

What are your alignment specs right now? It seems like you're having rollover problems with the tires despite the fact that they have stiff-as-hell sidewalls. What pressures are you running cold?
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Old 09-20-2005, 11:19 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJPimpFlex
I would venture to guess that its sub 2200 range.
You have been posting the most ridiculous shit lately. First, putting your car up for sale for $17,000 and now saying that your car is sub 2200.

A base model s13 coupe (no heavy hatch glass or sunroof) with no bumper supports, sound deading stripped, backseats removed, no AC, and manual belts comes in at about the mid 2400's. You are saying your car is 250-300 lbs lighter than that because you removed your dash, your door glass, and side impact beams. See where I'm going with this? Stop dreaming.
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Old 09-21-2005, 04:40 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree
That oil cooler can't be doing much. If you need an oil cooler, an upgrade is in order because honestly that one won't cut it. You'll also have to locate it in an area that sees more airflow through the cooling surface.
Oh well i posted my issue with the oil coler about 5 posts back, i have it in the headlight because there is no where else to put an oil cooler that is 4" think, i knw i know, the pics make it look 1" thick like the average oil cooler. As soon as i feel liek switching over to the DOHC bumper that has teh extra vents, ill move the cooler down under the factory battey location, and duct it and everything. And its deff enough, who would ever want to upgrade a 5"H X 6"L x 4"T oilcooler?


Quote:
Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree
I don't see anything really wrong with your battery placement, but it's a bit high. Other than that, it's over the axle so it doesn't really increase polar moment and it certainly helps f/r and l/r weight distribution. Since the car seems to be a purpose-built track car, why not put the battery lower, like in the passenger side rear footwell? That way your polar moment is decreased by a pretty hefty amount, not to mention your cG will go down a bit. You'll lose a little bit by way of rearward weight bias percentage but the l/r advantage will stay the same.
Thats where i had the battery located when i was driving the caron the street full interior and with shit rolling around my trunk, and i just havnt had the time to relocate it, a bit of a hassle when i have a few extras that run off of it, cause i dont wanna mess with my wiring again. I have is passenger side to makeup up for when its just me, and i have it rearward to help with traction, because im already having issues with it, as i said in earlier posts.



Quote:
Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree
What are your alignment specs right now? It seems like you're having rollover problems with the tires despite the fact that they have stiff-as-hell sidewalls. What pressures are you running cold?
Alignment is the factory specs, according to the alignment bay at my old place of business. Tire flex is due to a smaller tire being on the rim. NOt streched, but just not wide enough (itll be corrected before my next event with RA1's). I am running about 38psi hot, cold its like 32-34 i think, i adjusted them hot, havnt touched them since the last event, hard to recall the specifics. Rollover problem is not bue to the tires, its because i am running KYB shocks and Tein springs, apparently they dont get as stiff as they need to be for track racing, so those will get upgraded when i have the funds for it. (Buddy-Club Race Spec dampner).


All questions are welcome, but please read a little everyone before you tell me what you think i need to change, or look at the pictures a little more closely. I dont like repeting myself too often. Almost all the answers these questions are in the pics or already responded to. Keep them commin if i dont have anything on it tho.....
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Old 09-21-2005, 04:49 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flybert
You have been posting the most ridiculous shit lately. First, putting your car up for sale for $17,000 and now saying that your car is sub 2200.

A base model s13 coupe (no heavy hatch glass or sunroof) with no bumper supports, sound deading stripped, backseats removed, no AC, and manual belts comes in at about the mid 2400's. You are saying your car is 250-300 lbs lighter than that because you removed your dash, your door glass, and side impact beams. See where I'm going with this? Stop dreaming.

flybert please leave bickering with his FS ad, i dont want a fued here wasting space. I already said i dont htink it can ever get that light, and i have actually weighed my car on good scales, not just a hunch, 2200 would leave the car undriveable, and deff not safe to be in while driving it.
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Old 09-21-2005, 08:28 AM   #17
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Just a side note, a complete S13 door will weigh in at over 60 lbs. A stripped door with latch and outside handle is under 10 lbs. The impact beam is 3/16 steel and is probably about 25 lbs. That oil cooler needs to be relocated also, air just skims over the top. Think of the air as really stubborn. If you don't pimp it as hard as possible, it won't do what you want it to. Give it no other choice but to go through your cooler. That location would be fine if you made a completely sealed duct from the lower bumper up to the bottom of the cooler.
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Old 09-21-2005, 10:50 AM   #18
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im making a scoop from the top, itll attach to the hood and force air down through it, and ill duct the air back out the bottom for now until i get to my other setup. I have gone over the relocating of the cooler later in my race setup many times, pelase read over them.

The door situation is, most racing series dont let you remove the main door support, unless its AutoX, because of other cars on track, id like my door to have some ability to stay togeather if it gets bumped. I am moving at speeds more then 2 times that of the autoX 240 guys, so havign a waeak door is not somethign i suggets to people in road racing unless you have a full cage. And personally, i dont see any of the guys here making their doors as light as possible using a roll cage or door bars for that matter. Ill take out the windows and such when i get my cage in over the summer, but until then i need it there to brace myself till i get seats which ids after the cage for safety issues. As light as possible is not always the best decision, like i said before as long as its safe i support the dea, otherwise dont argue it here.
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Old 09-21-2005, 10:51 AM   #19
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PEOPLE READ ABOUT THE OIL COOLER STUFF IN PREVIOUS POSTS!!!!!

LOOK AT THE PICTURES AND READ BEFORE YOU MAKE SUGGESTIONS!!!!!

its the same stuff over and over.......
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Old 09-21-2005, 02:53 PM   #20
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im assuming you're running n/a 300zx non staggered wheels correct? (16x7.5 45offset). What size azenis are you running? I haven't road raced on my new tires yet, and because of hte hurricanes haven't even been able to autox on them either, but I run 255/40/17 falken azenis rt615s all around on 17x8.5 wheels w/ 25offset and find they stick very well. Just curious how they'd hold up on faster courses (90plus mph)
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Old 09-21-2005, 04:58 PM   #21
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120+ mph courses (fastes course i was on, im guesstimating i was up around 140mph) The Azenis Sports hold up you just cant expect them to be 100% once they heat up or if its a hot day(Hot day = 120 deg track temps). I slide every single corner, not alot, but enough to get me through them with out sliding off track. Ive driven the car hard enough to anticipate the slide, so i turn in early, and teh car slides around the corner to give me the better line at high speeds, but thats not the way to do it. Oh and i cant accelerate through the corners, ill spin out in a heart beat, so im only on teh throttle like 30% until i wind out more, then i can get on it more. I have heard alot of good things about the 615's but never got to run them, im moving right up to 225/50R16 Toyo RA1's for next season, i need the traction badly, my track times will drop dramatically if i can actually accelerate through the corners, a 1/4 sec each corner cut off is alot in the end of a bigger track, because itll change my exit speed and my overall top speed down the straits.
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Old 09-21-2005, 07:24 PM   #22
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Oh well i posted my issue with the oil coler about 5 posts back, i have it in the headlight because there is no where else to put an oil cooler that is 4" think, i knw i know, the pics make it look 1" thick like the average oil cooler. As soon as i feel liek switching over to the DOHC bumper that has teh extra vents, ill move the cooler down under the factory battey location, and duct it and everything. And its deff enough, who would ever want to upgrade a 5"H X 6"L x 4"T oilcooler?

You're the one who created the packaging issues by hanging that intercooler out front in a stock bumper. Besides, that oil cooler is made for a PLANE. You know, 70mph stall speed and 120+mph cruising with positive airflow at much lower ambient temps.

Thats where i had the battery located when i was driving the caron the street full interior and with shit rolling around my trunk, and i just havnt had the time to relocate it, a bit of a hassle when i have a few extras that run off of it, cause i dont wanna mess with my wiring again. I have is passenger side to makeup up for when its just me, and i have it rearward to help with traction, because im already having issues with it, as i said in earlier posts.

You're having issues with traction because you upgraded power before suspension and tires. You REALLY, REALLY should've done suspension either first or at the same time.

Alignment is the factory specs, according to the alignment bay at my old place of business. Tire flex is due to a smaller tire being on the rim. NOt streched, but just not wide enough (itll be corrected before my next event with RA1's). I am running about 38psi hot, cold its like 32-34 i think, i adjusted them hot, havnt touched them since the last event, hard to recall the specifics. Rollover problem is not bue to the tires, its because i am running KYB shocks and Tein springs, apparently they dont get as stiff as they need to be for track racing, so those will get upgraded when i have the funds for it. (Buddy-Club Race Spec dampner).

Tire flex is due to your lack of negative camber and lack of pressure. 34 is pretty low on the Azenis Sport. A smaller tire than designated on the rim would have REDUCED flex, not increased flex. You immediately disagree with yourself by saying the flex is not because of the tires, but the suspension. Which is it, according to you?

All questions are welcome, but please read a little everyone before you tell me what you think i need to change, or look at the pictures a little more closely. I dont like repeting myself too often. Almost all the answers these questions are in the pics or already responded to. Keep them commin if i dont have anything on it tho.....
Bold was me.

You made the classic mistake. You went for power and ended up forsaking the chassis. Now you complain that you can't go as fast as you want. Suck it up and realize that it's your own fault. That's my opinion of your setup. The race car guys you talked to didn't say a negative word because they were being polite. I guarantee they looked at each other after you left and said "what the hell was he thinking, doing power first?" There isn't just one way to set up a race car, but undertiring the car is certainly wrong.

By the way, 225s won't cut it. You'll need 245s or bigger. I hope you aren't incredibly fond of stock bodywork.
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Old 09-21-2005, 09:51 PM   #23
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Bold was me.

You made the classic mistake. You went for power and ended up forsaking the chassis. Now you complain that you can't go as fast as you want. Suck it up and realize that it's your own fault. That's my opinion of your setup. The race car guys you talked to didn't say a negative word because they were being polite. I guarantee they looked at each other after you left and said "what the hell was he thinking, doing power first?" There isn't just one way to set up a race car, but undertiring the car is certainly wrong.

By the way, 225s won't cut it. You'll need 245s or bigger. I hope you aren't incredibly fond of stock bodywork.

wow.......i didnt go for big power, 230whp is hardly big, im not complaining about any of it at all so there is nothign to suck up. I enjoy every second on track with an underpowered wide tired car or an overpower undertired car. And telling me the race guys were talkin shit behind my back, not cool. I ask for advice they give it to me, real advice not the BS your posting. you obviously dont understand tires that well, its not the size of the tire that means everything, teh Falken Azenis Sports that i was runngin are not enough now on teh track, when i was not moving as fast as i am now, they were enough, so now it is time to upgrade to only a slightly larger tire....but a different compound. The Falken Azenis are good track tires for an underpowered car, but th Toyo RA1's are a DOT approved R-Compound tire, MUCH different chacteristics than teh Azenis, MUCh better in every single aspect except wear maybe. a 225 wide r-compound tire with 230 whp will be plenty until i can afford to go with the suspension, wheel and tire setup i have planned for competition.

There is no need to tell me to suck anything up or deal with anything, i didnt critisize you at all when i responded to your post on here, simply explaining the setup. At least do some research on the tires i have on the car and the ones ill be running before you say one wont be enough for a certain setup. Or find out exactly what true race car builders have told me before you tell me they were callin me stupid for the order i did things. There is no eed to be so defensive, its ok, just make sure you know exactly what is expected of a race car and a budget and when you do finally know, deal with it.
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Old 09-21-2005, 10:08 PM   #24
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I have played around with my alignment for the last 3 years, as of now I only auto cross, but here are my specs...

The car is a 91 hatchback, w JIC flta'2s 7/5kg/mm spring rates. 15x7 + 0 offset w/225/45/15's victoracer's (econo racers!) White line sway's front and rear with custom fabricted spherical endlinks (BTW the endlinks make a huge difference, much much more predictable...). 50% spherical bearings 50% poly... (soon to be all metal)

Front camber) 3.7 negative ___ rear camber) 2.3 negative ... I have never been on a skid pad, but tire temp's are pretty even. I think you will need more or less camber depending upon Tires, and wheel rates. I have heard of other's running 5+ degrees up front and 3+ in the rear, but that effects braking.

Front toe) 1/16-1/8" toe out helps turn in, makes the car much more responsive.
Rear toe) 0 degrees__ I tried a little toe out a couple of times now, and the car is way to unpredictable, I don't recomend it. Toe in will help the car get the power down and help stabalize the car. I tried up to 1/8-3/8 toe in, which definetly stabalize's the car, but I like my car fairly twitchy for auto X'ing.

Well thats my setup, hope that helps -Jason M

P.S improvedtouringforum.com- look in the nissan section... thoose guy's know about the 240...Bob stretch did well with his 240 in ITA. You really need spherical bearings all the way around if you want to be competitive, reducing suspension bind is a big deal with 240's. (we have lots of bushings) Stretch ran on Advanced design double adjustle struts, with I believe GC's. Some (and possibly most) of the ITA guy's run without a rear bar, they say it make's the car more predictable...
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Old 09-21-2005, 10:12 PM   #25
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anmd now ill respond to all the lil things...

the oil cooler was free and will work just fine no matter what, its the same design as any other oilcooler, just 3x as thick. Current placement is becasue there is no other location with the bumper i got from the junkyeard that is on the car in the pictures, when i get the 91-94 bumper ill move the cooler to a better location, since i am moving at over 120+ mph on the straits of some courses, the cooler will get more than enough airflow over it. Cooler explained.

I DO have an upgraded suspension that works good for track time now, due to my limited budget. Traction is not the blame of the suspension, but the suspension and tires, i carry alot of momentum through teh runs and the suspension comrpeses alot(even tho its set to full stiff) , causing the body to roll and the tiures to be pushed a little further then they can handle. Which will cause the tire to flex, the Falken Azenis come with a very stiff sidewall, but with all the weight and momentum being forced to that corner of the car, its causing the tire to flex. I will NEVER strech a tire on a rim to reduce tir flex on the track, i dont care what anyone says, its not good to strech a tire ona track car, maybe a drift car, but not on the track, id rather use the tire to its fullest potential. Tire flex and suspension explained.

I dont HAVE to have negative camber, with a basic stock style suspension setup, im unabel to adjust camber the right way for a track car, which elminiates the possibility of using a basic camber kit, pillow-ball mounts are the right way to do it, but those are comming with the coilovers ill be getting in the future. My tire pressure is at 38psi hot, cold makes no difference becasue the tires are never cold when your on track, an person geared as much as yoruself towards suspension should know things like this. 40psi is suggested hot, but i prefer to run 38psi, the 40psi made the tire a little to hard for my liking.

Last but not least people..please knwo your info before you come on here telling me myse setup is wrong or i shoudl ahev done it thats or that way before, my budget is limited, so mods are limited to the not TOP-OF-THE-LINE products, deal with it, i did things in a specific order and will continure to do things in a specific order as my available funds come in. Keep questions comming, but please dont critisize my responses when i tell you how its setup ,or why its setup a certain way. I tell you why and you get defensive, no reason for all that just because its not your way. I apologize for my rant if it makes you angry, but i feel its neccessary because of the last poster getting all defensive and snappy with his response to my response.
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Old 09-21-2005, 10:25 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kapower
I have played around with my alignment for the last 3 years, as of now I only auto cross, but here are my specs...

The car is a 91 hatchback, w JIC flta'2s 7/5kg/mm spring rates. 15x7 + 0 offset w/225/45/15's victoracer's (econo racers!) White line sway's front and rear with custom fabricted spherical endlinks (BTW the endlinks make a huge difference, much much more predictable...). 50% spherical bearings 50% poly... (soon to be all metal)

Front camber) 3.7 negative ___ rear camber) 2.3 negative ... I have never been on a skid pad, but tire temp's are pretty even. I think you will need more or less camber depending upon Tires, and wheel rates. I have heard of other's running 5+ degrees up front and 3+ in the rear, but that effects braking.

Front toe) 1/16-1/8" toe out helps turn in, makes the car much more responsive.
Rear toe) 0 degrees__ I tried a little toe out a couple of times now, and the car is way to unpredictable, I don't recomend it. Toe in will help the car get the power down and help stabalize the car. I tried up to 1/8-3/8 toe in, which definetly stabalize's the car, but I like my car fairly twitchy for auto X'ing.

Well thats my setup, hope that helps -Jason M

P.S improvedtouringforum.com- look in the nissan section... thoose guy's know about the 240...Bob stretch did well with his 240 in ITA. You really need spherical bearings all the way around if you want to be competitive, reducing suspension bind is a big deal with 240's. (we have lots of bushings) Stretch ran on Advanced design double adjustle struts, with I believe GC's. Some (and possibly most) of the ITA guy's run without a rear bar, they say it make's the car more predictable...

I like your setup, only thing is i havnt heard many good things about the JIC coilovers, but thats all i ahev heard, no experience here. I have never autocrossed, but i know the low speeds and sharp turns require a very touchy suspension setup. I plan to go with adjustable links with bushings, i need the bushings to absord some stress from the road (being that some courses are rougher than others). I havnt planned to run as much negative camber as you, maybe -2 deg all around. and for toe in/out, id like them at 0 becasue of the long banking turns i dont need the tires fighting each other at all for the speeds im moving at.

I have talked to a few ITS or ITA guys before at VIR, most of them ran a basically stock setup, with coilovers and pillow ball mounts, but im not sure about all the links, i never had time to sit down, they were busy prepping the car for the races or qualifying track times. They are good to talk to about the ideas of the suspension, but i cant relate to them 100% because i plan to push more than twice their wheel HP once i get to comeptition, which means i need differnet breke, and tire setup then them. But their knowledge of suspension has been and will be helpful. Thanks for your advice and setup of your car, good reference, thanks jason.
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Old 09-21-2005, 10:36 PM   #27
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I think your off to a great start! Thanks for sharing your project online! I really enjoy folliwing projects involving 240's that actually see track time. keep us updated...

Why are you going with the Buddy club coil overs? Are they valved for race tires? I was told that none of the JDM coil overs are properly valved for race tires. Even the Zeal super functions say recomended for semi slick use.

I ended up going with the Jic's and they are amazing!!! Much better then my old KYB AGX RSR race spring set up, there was not enough travel up front I think I was riding the bump stops through the corners. I still think the GC's and advanced design option is the way to go, if you can afford it. double adjustable shocks are nice. -Jason M
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Old 09-21-2005, 11:27 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KA24DESOneThree
Bold was me.

You made the classic mistake. You went for power and ended up forsaking the chassis. Now you complain that you can't go as fast as you want. Suck it up and realize that it's your own fault. That's my opinion of your setup. The race car guys you talked to didn't say a negative word because they were being polite. I guarantee they looked at each other after you left and said "what the hell was he thinking, doing power first?" There isn't just one way to set up a race car, but undertiring the car is certainly wrong.

By the way, 225s won't cut it. You'll need 245s or bigger. I hope you aren't incredibly fond of stock bodywork.
Not sure what you mean by fan of stock bodywork? I put 285/20's on my car the other day with no rubbing just need the correct offsets. I would never run 20's on my car its a long story but 285's will fit under the stock rear fenders. I think 295's will.
I would have to agree with you though on power before setting the car up correctly. I am a much better drifter today than I would have been if I started with a high horsepower car. My car has a completly stock ka and I am doing almost everything before I do my swap and even after I swap the sr it will be almost completely stock with a stronger clutch and some bolt on's I would lots rather carry a lot of speed and be full throttle than have to modulate the clutch and throttle through the entire drift.

edit: go bigger than 225's you will regret it otherwise. With a stock ka I can spin 225/45-17 mich pilot sports all day long especially 2nd or 3rd gear drifts. if you want grip go to 245/45-16's
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Old 09-22-2005, 05:08 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kapower
I think your off to a great start! Thanks for sharing your project online! I really enjoy folliwing projects involving 240's that actually see track time. keep us updated...

Why are you going with the Buddy club coil overs? Are they valved for race tires? I was told that none of the JDM coil overs are properly valved for race tires. Even the Zeal super functions say recomended for semi slick use.

I ended up going with the Jic's and they are amazing!!! Much better then my old KYB AGX RSR race spring set up, there was not enough travel up front I think I was riding the bump stops through the corners. I still think the GC's and advanced design option is the way to go, if you can afford it. double adjustable shocks are nice. -Jason M

I chose the Buddy-Clubs because i know alot fo Honda/Acurs guys that run them for road racing, and the shock dyno charts proved that there are big difference between all the settings on the shock. BUddy Club has been involved in road racing for years on end in Japan and in the US, they have the reputation I needed to decide on what suspension to use for competition. They are valved stronger then most other shock, and the added bonus, they have US distributor that can rebuild teh shocks in teh US in teh event of a blow out, i dont know anyother company that does that with "JDM" products.

I hope the JICs were better then the KYB setup......much more going on, KYB is very basic, but i would nto consider it good for track use at all, after all my track time on almost the same exact setup.

Everyone i know tries to suggest certain setups for my grip racing when compared to their drifting, its much different setups going, you guys want everythign as stiff as possibleso itll slide, i need mine to give a little or absorb a little so itll stick.
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Old 09-22-2005, 05:22 AM   #30
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Quote:
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Not sure what you mean by fan of stock bodywork? I put 285/20's on my car the other day with no rubbing just need the correct offsets. I would never run 20's on my car its a long story but 285's will fit under the stock rear fenders. I think 295's will.
I would have to agree with you though on power before setting the car up correctly. I am a much better drifter today than I would have been if I started with a high horsepower car. My car has a completly stock ka and I am doing almost everything before I do my swap and even after I swap the sr it will be almost completely stock with a stronger clutch and some bolt on's I would lots rather carry a lot of speed and be full throttle than have to modulate the clutch and throttle through the entire drift.

edit: go bigger than 225's you will regret it otherwise. With a stock ka I can spin 225/45-17 mich pilot sports all day long especially 2nd or 3rd gear drifts. if you want grip go to 245/45-16's

I never plan to go wider than 275 all around, i make my own fender flares that rivet onto the existing fenders and give me an extra 1.75 inches of clearence on each corner to fit the 17x10's with the 275/40 series tries i plan to run for competition.

I used this car as a daily driver for about the past year driving to school work everything, I did the power because my first 240 had a blown motor so i swapped this in, then second 240 i got (this one) had a blown motor and a melted fusebox, so i fixed all that and slowly it got to the point is is today. I did mild suspension with grippy tires for how i have been driving on the track. I moved the tries up form the old ones i was driving on before, everyone seems to think that extreme traction is teh way to go with a track car, but to learn the car you have to actually learn what it can /cant do with or without traction. the small tires i used for the 4 track events this past year worked great, i dont complain, i simply say they werent enough for me to do my best. I am upgrading to the 225/50R16 Toyo RA1's, they are an R-COMPOUND TIRE!! VERY sticky for the track once heated up, i am not ment to go 100% throttle through every corner at every possible second, that not how you road race, so i dont need a relly wide tire yet until i upgrade my power some more. Drifting a a 245 tire is alot different from gripping with an r-compound, as around at race shops about r-compounds, for a car with my setup 225 is fine especially for the rim size i have (16x7.5). At the shop by me, some guy boughta 240 all setup for grip that came with brand new Toyo RA1's 245/40R17's, he traded them for soem used tres with far less traction so he could drift the car beasue the RA1's are way too sticky for drifting, so you need to realize that you 245 pilots are less sticky than my 225 RA1 R-Compounds, so a comparison cant be made between the two.


DRIFTERS PLEASE READ UP ON R-COMPOUND TIRES BEFORE YOU POST ABOUT MY TIRE CHOICES!!!!! SPECIFICALLY "Toyo RA1" TIRES!!!!!
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