Road Race setup/ Track pics

[snatch13]

Originally Posted by WhiteGLX

i should have some good video from Sat/Sun as well as Traqmate Data Aquisition for helping me improve my line and corner speeds, etc...

Be ready for alot of information after next weekend. Its going to be good.

Did you get the GPS unit? I'm thinking of getting that or the Stack.

[WhiteGLX]

GPS, its my brothers setup, i just need to fit it in my car.

[snatch13]

Nice... let me know how you/your brother likes it. Looks to be a decent unit - we should be getting the AIM GPS module (we run a AIM EVO3) for our project car so I'm looking forward to working with that.

[rb25_s13*CHUKI]

Originally Posted by WhiteGLX

thats a very steady upgrade in quality.....ITR i would remove, not a great track car from factory nor very fast....to keep things within a reasonable price range id stick with Z06, EVO RS, STI, Elise, not much else off the top of my head i would choose and keep in the reasonable new factory price range.

[ame]http://youtube.com/watch?v=iQnoxWUIL4c&feature=related[/ame]

Idk itr's do get up pretty quick for a n/a 1.8 liter...Their track capability's aren't that bad either... Ill be posting my track setup as soon as i find the right coupe...

[WhiteGLX]

my brother used it a few times last year worked great for him, especially since we could compare our data with that from HC racers, allowing my brother to find out where he is losing time and speed in comparison and such.

its not a whole dash unit though, just a small display that you mount anywhere within reach.

[WhiteGLX]

Originally Posted by rb25_s13*CHUKI

http://youtube.com/watch?v=iQnoxWUIL4c&feature=related

Idk itr's do get up pretty quick for a n/a 1.8 liter...Their track capability's aren't that bad either... Ill be posting my track setup as soon as i find the right coupe...

its an old video that i saw back in 2003. Just because one person does one thing with a car in a strait line doesnt mean it will do everything its said to be capable of. My brother had an ITR it was rare, it was fun, it was what i used to consider quick, then it was stolen. overall....an overated car in my mind. Any integra with a K20 swap would be better and worth 1/2 as much as an ITR, so what is the benefit?

[racepar1]

Originally Posted by WhiteGLX

UPDATE!!!!

Suspension is done
Camber - -2* F/R
Caster - 6.5* F (not adjustable)
Toe - 0* F/R

all new ES bushings, sway bar links, Ohlins suspension and soon to be Cobalt XR2 brake pads. We will see how the suspension feels once i can get out on the road later today or tomarrow and moe it around a little to findout if there is anything wrong. I should be just fine, but i cant make that promise to myself anf just hope for the best.


I am attending the NASA MA instructor clinic next friday and instruting for my first time that very same weekend at VIR. I am very excited and nervous at the same time. We ill see how everything goes, i should have some good video from Sat/Sun as well as Traqmate Data Aquisition for helping me improve my line and corner speeds, etc...

Be ready for alot of information after next weekend. Its going to be good.

With that amount of caster in the front I think you should DEFINITELY run more camber. I also think 1/16" total toe in in the rear would help the car off the corners. I am running 7* caster, 2.8* camber, 0 toe in the front; and 2* camber, 1/16" total toe in, and 1/4" shorter trac arms in the rear. Shortening the trac arms seemed to help the car off the corners a LOT even though I reduced the total toe in by half (I used to run 1/8" total toe in in the rear). I also added about 1/2* more caster in the front and .2* less camber to help cure my very slight understeer problem at turn in and it seemd to work, but I really need to go back to the streets to confirm it.

[snatch13]

racepar1 - why toe in in the rear?

[WhiteGLX]

Originally Posted by snatch13

racepar1 - why toe in in the rear?

The toe in in the rar will make the rear more stable, on any turn the outside wheel will be slightly facing the direction you want to be going and help get you there.

I am running factory caster settings (6.5*-7.5*) because im am running the factory tension rods up front.. And i will run 0* toe at all times because toe in or out will reduce the life of r-comps very quickly, since im budgeting my used r-comps and trying to get them to last as long as possible i run 0* toe. The cambers settings are just the begining, i planb to adjust it more at the track, i just need to get a feeel for 2* first and see if the tires still wear evenly, then maybe ill step it up.

My car has been running 0* toe for its whole life with me and i have never been disatisfied with it, yet another reason for me to keep it at 0*. If i start to have issues with corner exiting or or anythign like that ill just adjust my driving style or smooth out my motions a little to prevent the car from unsettling, pretty easy to adapt to if you are in tune with your car.

[racepar1]

BUT, you can drive a LOT faster when you do not have to adapt. I guess I understand the budgeting aspect, but if you rotate the tires regularly 1/16" TOTAL toe in shouldn't affect wear very much at all, maybe one less event.

[McRussellPants]

Bank of TWS.


Getting too Greedy trying to use curbing to set the car.

[WhiteGLX]

Originally Posted by racepar1

BUT, you can drive a LOT faster when you do not have to adapt. I guess I understand the budgeting aspect, but if you rotate the tires regularly 1/16" TOTAL toe in shouldn't affect wear very much at all, maybe one less event.

im not talking about adapting to anything big, but 1/16" toe doesnt seem like it would make any difference anyways. Having a set of tires last a whole extra event is alot of money saved. considering used r-comps last about 3-4 events anways. I would rather budget and save money on tires when i could spend that extra money saved on more seat time than just more suspension adjustments and the results of them. make sense?

for instance i went 2 years without changing my entire suspension setup because i wanted to conentrate on my driving rather then modifying the car. That why i have 36+ track days under my belt and i am an instructor this year, if i spent all my time and money replaceing parts that could have been saved i would have half the time by now, and probobly still wouldnt be that intune with my car.

[McRussellPants]

Originally Posted by WhiteGLX

for instance i went 2 years without changing my entire suspension setup because i wanted to conentrate on my driving rather then modifying the car. That why i have 36+ track days under my belt and i am an instructor this year, if i spent all my time and money replaceing parts that could have been saved i would have half the time by now, and probobly still wouldnt be that intune with my car.

Bump for the most troofest thing ever posted ever.

I hit 2 events a month last year bare minimum. Just because my car was rock solid reliable and I'd rather drive/pay for tires than eat my shit over how much ES bushings helped my car handle and have it down for months on end.

god I want my car back.

[racepar1]

Originally Posted by WhiteGLX

im not talking about adapting to anything big, but 1/16" toe doesnt seem like it would make any difference anyways. Having a set of tires last a whole extra event is alot of money saved. considering used r-comps last about 3-4 events anways. I would rather budget and save money on tires when i could spend that extra money saved on more seat time than just more suspension adjustments and the results of them. make sense?

for instance i went 2 years without changing my entire suspension setup because i wanted to conentrate on my driving rather then modifying the car. That why i have 36+ track days under my belt and i am an instructor this year, if i spent all my time and money replaceing parts that could have been saved i would have half the time by now, and probobly still wouldnt be that intune with my car.

It's funny, you think exactly like a I think a driving instructor should (all about the driving), and I think like a pit mechanic should (all about the car). I really do need to concentrate a bit more on the driving, but I have been a pit mechanic my whole life so I just can't bring myself to ignore the car. I think you might be surprised at how much of a difference 1/16" can make. And I would probably be a bit surprised at how much saying fuck the car and just driving it for a while can make. As soon as I finish the projects that I already have started I think I am going to do that for a while.

[WhiteGLX]

its not so much as saying fuck the car, but spend time on teh car building it right and solid the first time around, not all blinged out and super powerful, just solid and reliable. Then go out driving and enjoy it without worrying and always eager to modify.

thats why i went so long without changing anythign because i didnt really have anyproblems besides a coilpack and an ignitor channel going bad, thats my only problem in 2 years. it cost me an entire event because it was an issue i couldnt predict happening and spent too much time diagnosing. Now i spend alot of time in the off season checking, rechecking and then tightening everything to make sure it will stay togeather.

i have changed little things but nothing major that would make me unused to the car for an event i was paying $$$$ to attend. This way i knew the car would run, and stop and i would be happy just being able to use it. As long as my car runs ill use it. I never neglect the car, it sjust doesnt ever need much maintenance because i spend so much time inspecting and such in the off season. Its one of my habbits as an aviation tech. make sure everything is perfect the first time around, only one real chance to get it right.

Try not modifying your car at all (minus tires and brake pads) for an entire season, not working on the car all the time, having it down unexpectidly for some unknown reason is a frustration i was tired of many years ago. Try not modifying the car and im sure you will enjoy your tracking much more, you will see how much your lap times change through an entire season with just changing your driving style, smoothness, compressing braking zones, adapting to mid turn passes, and improving your line for better exit speeds. All these things are hard to improve if everyevent the car has changed. Its a lesson they encourage here on the east coast big time, at least with NASA. Not sure abotu other groups.

[ESCALVANTE]

Originally Posted by racepar1

With that amount of caster in the front I think you should DEFINITELY run more camber. I also think 1/16" total toe in in the rear would help the car off the corners. I am running 7* caster, 2.8* camber, 0 toe in the front; and 2* camber, 1/16" total toe in, and 1/4" shorter trac arms in the rear. Shortening the trac arms seemed to help the car off the corners a LOT even though I reduced the total toe in by half (I used to run 1/8" total toe in in the rear). I also added about 1/2* more caster in the front and .2* less camber to help cure my very slight understeer problem at turn in and it seemd to work, but I really need to go back to the streets to confirm it.

I can second a lot of what is being said in this post. My alignment specs are as follows:

Front Specs:
2.5 degrees camber
6.0 caster degrees on left/6.5 caster degrees on right
toe in total: 1/16 inches
Rear Specs:
3.0 degrees camber
toe in total 3/16

I used to run less aggressive settings but my car was oversteering on corner exit and squirrelly during braking. My camber was about .5" degrees less front and back which made me ride my tire sidewalls at ButtonWillow. With these settings I have pretty much fixed the problems and the car is much more stable.

[racepar1]

I didn't mean neglect it I meant avoid major mods. Before I can comfortably drive the hell out of the car for an entire season I really need at least z-brakes ( I still have the stockers) and I need to re-build my KA (compression is pretty low, rings are leaking). I hate people who are like OMFG, I need brembos, a big ass turbo, $20,000 of suspension mods, and hoosiers before I go to the track! I have a couple of buddies like that and I keep trying to tell them to just go out and have fun!

[ESCALVANTE]

Originally Posted by racepar1

I didn't mean neglect it I meant avoid major mods. Before I can comfortably drive the hell out of the car for an entire season I really need at least z-brakes ( I still have the stockers) and I need to re-build my KA (compression is pretty low, rings are leaking). I hate people who are like OMFG, I need brembos, a big ass turbo, $20,000 of suspension mods, and hoosiers before I go to the track! I have a couple of buddies like that and I keep trying to tell them to just go out and have fun!

I'm with you. There are some bare essentials you should do to your car before hitting the track. Upgrading brake and clutch fluids is a must as well brake pads. I went with coilovers, wheels and tires, rotors, intake and exhaust because I had to replace my faulty stock hardware. Other than that, getting seat time is the best thing you could do to your car.

Remember that "There aren't any fast cars, just fast drivers." I truly believe that as I get faster after each track event.

[bigOdom1]

most people have daily driver 240sx not track 240sx. im trying for the best mix between both but i have a daily driver for incase the 240 is down. with that said; most people want a really nice and reliable daily so they avoid the track or spend lots of money on parts they want instead of spending it on track time.

[WhiteGLX]

it could be very easy to trck your DD, as long as you spend the time checking a bunch of points over the car before and after each event to ensure that you can get to and from teh track in one piece, and the to be sure you can go for weeks daily driving the car without fault. This goes for any car that someone wants to track and DD. Just pay attention and inspect things instead of letting problems go untouched, fix them right away and then continue to go about your way without attempting to upgrade your turbo or suspension just because your car is down for new front bushings. Just replace the bushings and then go abotu your business. And if you dont think ou can handle having one car for everythign then figue out what works and do it. If you feel you are workgin too hard to get to the track and not enjoying it....then its not for you anyways. Enjoy the car and the experience, dont just work for it. I make sure that i have fun no matter what.....even when my brother totaled his civic at VIR....we still had a great weekend and managed to have a great 5hr conversation ont eh trip home, since he rode shotgun in the truck with me towing his car instead of mine.


the whole point of anyof us going to the track and doing HPDE's for years and years is simply to enjoy the experience because 90% of people who do HPDE's dont race, just go enjoy and maybe do it 2x a year, the other majoyity are hooked and go time and time again for the thrill and excitment and the sense of comrodary (spelled wrong, but whateva). Go and enjoy, dont get frustradted or overwhelmed with efforts to make the car last or frustrated with not improving lap times, its not a race unless unless your W2W, otherwise its just fun and educational.



sorry for all the rants guys, i feel i need to get my points across and clear up confusion with how track days and weekends and misconceptions should really be interpreted. Ill keep everything short form now on, i sort of promise...

[racepar1]

Originally Posted by bigOdom1

most people have daily driver 240sx not track 240sx. im trying for the best mix between both but i have a daily driver for incase the 240 is down. with that said; most people want a really nice and reliable daily so they avoid the track or spend lots of money on parts they want instead of spending it on track time.

The reason people are afraid to track their daily's is because they don't properly maintain them. I have seen it a million times. A guy buys a used car to modify and immediately starts stacking parts in the closet. Meanwhile the car leaks every fluid from everywhere, needs a MAJOR tune-up, and is just generally falling apart. Then said guy goes ahead and installs all those "shiny objects" thinking that his car will be dope afterwards. Really all he ends up with is a piece of shit car with a few shiny objects. Before you buy one single "shiny" part for your car do the maintenance. Do a COMPLETE tune-up, clean the MAF, fix ALL the leaks, new belts, new hoses, change ALL the fluids with better stuff, etc..... The FIRST upgrade on any car that is intended for high performance useage should be bushings, the second should be shocks, and the third should be brake pads. After that go to the track and upgrade the driver. I STILL daily my 240 half the time. Even with 180+k on the stock engine and trans and a complete lack of anything resembling an interior. I track it too! Why can I get away with that? Because absolutely EVERY SINGLE maintenance item has been performed and is regularly checked. My car is on the rack and inspected at least once a week. That is why I can beat the living shit out of it at the track and formerly in the canyons and still daily it.

[bigOdom1]

preaching to the choir here. i have been to both a FEB, and MAR autox this year and just drove it to the beach and back five hours each way. granted i had to tighten some shit before i went and again when i got there and again when I got home, but i plan to attend an autox a month and a track day or two this year all along doing other things that i want to. but then again thats why i didn't drive it for the entire months of dec. and jan. (so it would be in shape to tackle the other ten months

[ESCALVANTE]

Originally Posted by bigOdom1

preaching to the choir here. i have been to both a FEB, and MAR autox this year and just drove it to the beach and back five hours each way. granted i had to tighten some shit before i went and again when i got there and again when I got home, but i plan to attend an autox a month and a track day or two this year all along doing other things that i want to. but then again thats why i didn't drive it for the entire months of dec. and jan. (so it would be in shape to tackle the other ten months

I have a home office and only drive my car when I have to because I want to 'conserve' it for track days. I change my fluids before I hit the track and make sure to check everything before heading onto the track. I also check everything after every track session.
I learned to do this the hard way by losing an oil cap on track and it created all sorts of problems. I had oil everywhere, messed up spark plugs and a ruined alternator.

Moral of the story: make sure you check EVERYTHING before heading onto the track.

[bigOdom1]

yeah i had a dripping fuel line that was going onto my alternator once. luckily we saw it before it caught fire

[steve shadows]

I just wish I had a trailor, It would make it a lot more stress free when going about 120 miles - 165 miles from home for track experience.

[bigOdom1]

i feel you i wish i had a trailer and an extra hundo to get a hotel the night before so i would not have to get up before the roosters to drive two hours to events

[WhiteGLX]

why dont you guys camp out.....if it rains sleep in your car, if its cold bundle up with blankets in a tent. It is the cheapest way to leave the night before and be well rested before an event.

you dont NEED trailers just take care of your car and keep it out of the tire walls. You are just as likely to break down on a road trip to the beach as you are a the track, your not going to trailer your car everywhere in fear of it breaking down are you? And if you sincerely think your car wont make it through an entire track event then you should fix the issues or wait until the car is ready for an event.

i would love to be able to drive my track car to events still.....a small fire ruined my chassis harness many yeas ago and left me with only one choice, go custom wiring and trailer. if i could i would most deffinitly still drive the car 7hrs to the tracks.

[WhiteGLX]

welp here is the bad news then....

Through my track time on friday and saturday i had a few issues show up on track with my engine. Lower rad hose popped off halfway through friday on track, fun experience. Popped the hood to show large coolant mess (to be expected) and large oil mess on drivers side of engine.

after cleanup and refill of coolant, no oil leaks of anyind decide to show up (weird) and coolant will no pressurize to the point of popping off with engien at 5k rpm while parked in the paddock. So i go out on track saturday morning everythign is fine. Then i go out again and decide to pit eary just to check on everything, sure as hell the oil mess is back and a coolant hose is almost popped off again, wait for the engine to cool down, release the rad cap.....HUGE burst of air comes out....

I am bleeding boost into the cooling system, which is why the problem is only presistant on track while engine is under load. And the oil leak occurs when the coolant system get sooo pressurized that the extra pressure affects teh oil system somehow and bleeds oil out from under the exhaust manifold.

SOOOOOO new headgasket, new ARP headstuds (to be safe), and Headchecking to be sure of no cracks or warpage. Gimme like 2 weeks and ill be up and running again ready for my many other tracks events at Summit Point, VIR and Mid-Ohio to come this year.


due to the massive amount of down time and troubleshooting i didnt bother installing te traqmate since my times were just me getting used to the car firsthing friday and driving in the ran on saturday. Next events will be better once hte pressure problems are all fixed. I am thinking cosworth headgasket with the arpheadstuds....or Apexi 0.8mm....one or the other.

[WhiteGLX]

Cosworth headgasket, OEM waterpump, valvecover gasket and valve seals on the way.....

head is being checked for flatness and pressure checked for cracks, possibly shaved if not flat. Car will be back togeather in a week hoperfully ready to run and get out on teh track in may.

I am signing up for more track events soon.....

May
17-18 - Summit Point Shenendoah
23-25 - VIR Full

June
21-22 - Summit Point Main

July
19-20 - GINGERMAN RACEWAY

August
Mid-Ohio Raceway

October
4-5 - Summit Point Shenendoah
11-12 - Summit Point Main

November
1-2 - Summit Point Shenendoah
__________________

[PoorMans180SX]

Dang, rough on the HG.

I think I'm going to take my car up to gingerman a few times this year, they're pretty loose with regulations on test and tune days. Hopefully I'll have enough money to prepare it well. It's going to new a few things (okay, more than a few!)