The 90's were the height of Import Performance...what the hell happened?

[LI NY 240sx]

I just don't like that you can't get the R35 with a true manual transmission. If I had the money to buy one, I think that might cause me to look into something else.

[Cheesy Doriftos]

i'd take an R35 over any 90's FWD honda that's for damn sure.

[Matej]

[StruckANerve]

The R35 doesn't really apply in this discussion considering it's nearly 100 grand. It's more comparable to ferrari and porche.

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[Cheesy Doriftos]

nsx's and fd rx-7's weren't that affordable to us broke bois in the 90's either.

[TougeSR20Kid]

Originally Posted by StruckANerve

The R35 doesn't really apply in this discussion considering it's nearly 100 grand. It's more comparable to ferrari and porche.

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How does it not apply in this discussion? Its from this era and from Japan. That is the discussion. I mean lets be real when the Supras and Skylines and FD's came out they were hella expensive also. I mean a regular old Turbo Supra was a $40,000 car in 1995 and thats without any of the extras. In today's money that'd be like $62,000 which still isn't as the GTR is but still high and unaffordable for most.

But this whole argument is very opinion based one. I mean there were other badass cars produced post 2000 from Japan. FRS are pretty dope, so are a lot of the new subies. Did you completely forget about Mitsu Evo's? Sure they're not RWD and driftable but they are pretty beastly street cars nonetheless. I would rock the hell out of an EVO X if i had the money.

[TougeSR20Kid]

Originally Posted by Cheesy Doriftos

nsx's and fd rx-7's weren't that affordable to us broke bois in the 90's either.

Exactly, I forgot to use the NSX as an example but you're correct. The later 90's models sold for like $89k

[feito]

yeah!!! fuck the 60's and 70's!!!

[kashira kureijii]

^ NO TE27 LEVIN, 0/10

[supersayianjim]

yes, the modern cars suck ass. there automatics and un-sporty. Toyota has dropped out of the SERIOUS sports car game. and all that's left is Nissan who are still serious about making a fast 5 speed import car.

[murda-c]

Originally Posted by supersayianjim

yes, the modern cars suck ass. there automatics and un-sporty. Toyota has dropped out of the SERIOUS sports car game. and all that's left is Nissan who are still serious about making a fast 5 speed import car.

which car is that?

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by supersayianjim

yes, the modern cars suck ass. there automatics and un-sporty. Toyota has dropped out of the SERIOUS sports car game. and all that's left is Nissan who are still serious about making a fast 5 speed import car.

Yes but look at the other cars we get.

We now have two options of Civic Si and a turbo on the way.

We have a large range of turbo Hyundais and Kias. The Optima is fucking dope as shit.

We also have turbo Subarus and turbo Mazdas.

When you look at USDM Japanese offerings in the 90's, they where actually not the stellar.

Truck motor KA powered 240 secretary cars. Two years for a SOCH Civic "Si" and Two years for a B16 "Si". No WRX, No Skyline, No Evo, No Turbo Soarer, No Turbo anything Lexus. No turbo Sentra, etc.

Mazda did nothing in the 90's. Also if you where 18 in 1993, anything cool would have been astronomically out of your price range. A MKIV Supra was a $60,000 car in today's money.


In 20 years people will be gushing over today. 300hp turbo WRX, Mazda 3, Focus and Fiesta ST. Turbo Mustang and Camaro. Genesis Coupe, Audi S4, BMW 330. +400hp Camaro, Challenger, Mustang, Corvette, M3, and Lexus ISF.

And now we have +550hp Shelbys, Zo6, 911 Turbos, GTRs, CTS-V, ZL1 and of course the 700hp Challenger that costs as much as a 90's Supra.

All the while these cars have gained 50% in fuel economy, have extraordinary safety features, handle better, brake better and have interiors that surpass luxury cars from 15 years ago.

[TurboTiger]

Tons of great options nowadays.

[ixfxi]

and modern cars are drive by wire which sucks fuckin cock
and they are obd-ii which also sucks fuckin cock

id rather have obd2 with useful info vs blinking led bullshit with obd1. however, i wish all manufacturers would have included ecus that give false readings like vw - that would be nice.

you just cant win them all. there are pros and cons to everything i guess.

[Matej]

Old cars are fun to tinker with because they are simple. New cars seem like a nightmare to mod.
Even if automakers make all the 'spiritual' S-chassis/Supra/RX7 successors people want, I think I will rather stick to old embarrassing pre-mid-90s cars as a hobby.
That is unless someone releases an appealing barebones car, similar to the Alfa Romeo 4C.

[turboshoebox]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

and modern cars are drive by wire which sucks fuckin cock
and they are obd-ii which also sucks fuckin cock

id rather have obd2 with useful info vs blinking led bullshit with obd1. however, i wish all manufacturers would have included ecus that give false readings like vw - that would be nice.

you just cant win them all. there are pros and cons to everything i guess.

Why is being odb II such a big deal? Had a 97 s14 with sr20 swap, cams, bigger turbo, power FC etc etc. but being obd ii didn't seem to effect me?

[Matej]

Originally Posted by turboshoebox

Why is being odb II such a big deal? Had a 97 s14 with sr20 swap, cams, bigger turbo, power FC etc etc. but being obd ii didn't seem to effect me?

Until you have to plug it in to pass an annual/biennial inspection in various states/counties.

[turboshoebox]

Originally Posted by Matej

Until you have to plug it in to pass an annual/biennial inspection in various states/counties.

obd1 or 2 it doesnt matter. SR20 Swap is illegal in california. So both have to become friends with a smog guy if u know what i mean

[Matej]

Yes, people employ shady/illegal ways of circumventing the inspection, but it still poses a hassle and presents an annoying hurdle to modding OBDII cars in many places. If you go SR you already know what you are getting into, but some people just want to have a bit of fun with their car without feeling like a criminal for modding it.

[tlieberman240]

Height of performance? Pffft

Modern day Evo and STI outperform the R34 substantially.
Hell, the civic type r from like '07 lapped Suzuka faster than the FD, NSX, and R34 by like 4 seconds. The R35 is miles ahead in terms of performance in comparison to all those cars.

If you're talking about aesthetics, fine, but all that is subjective. When you're talking about performance numbers and stats, then get real.

[turboshoebox]

Originally Posted by Matej

Yes, people employ shady/illegal ways of circumventing the inspection, but it still poses a hassle and presents an annoying hurdle to modding OBDII cars in many places. If you go SR you already know what you are getting into, but some people just want to have a bit of fun with their car without feeling like a criminal for modding it.

so why is obd ii such a big deal then then?

If u are obd 1 or 2 you stilll have to go thru the same hassle to pass smog or inspections?

[turboshoebox]

Originally Posted by tlieberman240

Height of performance? Pffft

Modern day Evo and STI outperform the R34 substantially.
Hell, the civic type r from like '07 lapped Suzuka faster than the FD, NSX, and R34 by like 4 seconds. The R35 is miles ahead in terms of performance in comparison to all those cars.

If you're talking about aesthetics, fine, but all that is subjective. When you're talking about performance numbers and stats, then get real.

Speaking in the sense of the 90's were the coolest cars of the import sport compact/performance cars. I know I might be being nostalgic but none of the current cars have the same "soul" as the old cars.

The only one I slightly like is the EVO 9 or Z34. R35, STI, BRZ etc etc. does nothing for me. Just not the same.

[tlieberman240]

It's called moving with the times. None of those cars would even be able to come out in today's world thanks to the safety standards and emissions regulations.

Not only that, but these manufacturers are in the business to make money. The companies have no interest in catering to such a niche group of people if it's not going to make them money in the end. Hence, why every manufacturer is filled with Ecoboxes, rather than 2 seater, lightweight sports cars.

[turboshoebox]

It doesn't have to be a two seater to be a sport compact. Within the last 10 years we had

MR-S
Miata
RX8
Evo 8-10
Z33-34
R35
WRX and sti variations etc.
Mazda 3 or 6 or whichever the fuck the turbo ones were
BRZ/FRS
Genesis Turbo coupe
Scion 2 door model (forgot which one is was)
Lexus ISF
Civic SI
RSX type s or whatever the hell it was


I'm sure there's a few I missed but I got most of them as far as the ones that would appeal to the import performance crowd. I understand times have changed but it again might just be me thinking about the good ol days in the 90's when I was much younger but i don't feel the current offering excite me like the way they did during that time.

Sure they may be faster and better handling then the 90's cars but i don't get excited for the past 10ish years of the newer offering like the 90's.

Of course the stand out cars for the 90's were the supra, rx7, 300zx, 240sx, 3000 GT, 240sx as far as US offerings. Of course durring that time was the r32-34 and the S15 even tho it wasn't here for the US market.

[tlieberman240]

So then stick with cars from the 90s?

[turboshoebox]

that's the plan. I can't be the only one that feels this way. sure there are some alright cars of the more recent ones but not ones that invoke excitement like the 90's era

[civilized_drifter]

turboshoebox post your turbo 240 volvo, and you forgot to mention the cappucino. Jeremy Clarkson once said its the epitome of 90's performance.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by Matej

Until you have to plug it in to pass an annual/biennial inspection in various states/counties.

Then move.

Some States, like California, are continuing to talk about outright removing pre-OBD II cars from registration and even using another "cash for clunckers" deal.

OBD-2 is great because you can actually know when something has gone astray and what it is.

Modern car ECUs are actually proficient at running cars and can be tuned by their OBD port unlike old garbage like the 240 and its compatriots.

[Corbic]

Originally Posted by Matej

Yes, people employ shady/illegal ways of circumventing the inspection, but it still poses a hassle and presents an annoying hurdle to modding OBDII cars in many places. If you go SR you already know what you are getting into, but some people just want to have a bit of fun with their car without feeling like a criminal for modding it.

Time to go LS Carb Legal swapping then!

A hair over $7k and it comes with everything to run the engine. Just mate it up to whatever transmission and mounts you need. 430hp, warranty, brand new and 50 state legal in any car.



Considering a used LS3 pullout with trans is normally $8,500, that's actually not a bad deal.

[Croustibat]

Originally Posted by ixfxi

however, i wish all manufacturers would have included ecus that give false readings like vw - that would be nice.

Actually there are a lot of them. That vw crap was a remote controlled coup to remove a performing foreign actor from US territory. The comparison would really have been funny if they chose a bmw mini with the 1.6L turbo diesel engine, as ...they share the same engine management - and i don't believe a second bmw didn't use the "cheat option". Basically, most diesel engines use cheat one way or another to pass emissions.

And frankly, you want that. Unless you'd rather change your cats and EGR valves every 20.000 miles.