S13 & S14 Rear Ball Joints Answered - Zilvia.net Forums | Nissan 240SX (Silvia) and Z (Fairlady) Car Forum

Adikt · 03-04-2007, 02:58 PM

S13 & S14 Rear Ball Joints
Nissan doesn't sell the ball joint separate from the rear lower control arm. Upon doing some digging the following will work in the rear

S13 = B13 SE-R front, we used MOOG Part # K9449

S14 = Same as S14 front, I used MOOG Part # K9820

projectRDM · 03-04-2007, 05:50 PM

And you're certain these have the correct taper? If so that's great, but you'd also think they'd cross it over if it did indeed fit both models.

*MELLO*SOS* · 03-17-2007, 06:13 PM

According to the NAPA website, they have B13 upper and lower ball joints, is there any difference? Both show the same non-Napa PN, K9449

http://www.napaautoparts.com/MasterP...MPartNum=K9449

UNISA JECS · 03-17-2007, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mello88

According to the NAPA website, they have B13 upper and lower ball joints, is there any difference? Both show the same non-Napa PN, K9449

http://www.napaautoparts.com/MasterP...MPartNum=K9449

The B13 has no upper ball joint in the front or rear only lower.

Munch · 03-17-2007, 07:56 PM

So is this definite? I dont wanna havta go out and buy some ball joins i think will work in my rear and end up braking something cause they fell off or whatever.

Sounds awesome though.

Zenki_Toronto · 04-11-2007, 12:21 PM

Hi,

It seems like a lot of ppl are running into this problem! (ALL 240 owners apparently)

Has anyone figured out if the "S14 front lower ball joint = S14 rear lower ball joint" question?

I've checked this thread about this person claiming he has done it without measuring it and it worked out perfectly fine. However, he's banned so I cant contact him to see how it's holding up until now and really, one guy's story can't be taken seriously unless it is confirmed by numerous other sources...

http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.p...ear+ball+joint

Thanks.
Nima

projectRDM · 04-11-2007, 12:43 PM

They do not interchange fron to rear, this is fact. As for other models crossing over, I'd seriously think a manafacturer would detail that. Odds are that there still is not a direct fit, OE replacement for the rear Aarm for either S13 or S14, but people are getting away with 'close' and not breaking anything yet.

jackal264 · 04-11-2007, 03:45 PM

i'm in the middle of this problem to. are you 100% sure the s14 rears are diff then the s14 fronts? i went out and bought a moog #k9820 and it looks identical but i'm not gonna put it in unless its safe.

89dc240 · 07-06-2007, 02:22 PM

Adikt,,, You have personally used the b13 ball joint in the rear of an S13? How'd it go, still working in there?

turtl631 · 07-06-2007, 07:34 PM

Honestly, someone who has tried this or has some ball joints needs to whip out a caliper and start taking measurements. Its not something you want to eyeball and take a chance on, but if there's a good alternative to new arms, this will save people a lot of money.

Sir · 07-06-2007, 09:40 PM

this is Adikt at a local event

http://s134.photobucket.com/albums/q...t=P1010143.flv

I'd say they're holding up just fine.

89dc240 · 07-07-2007, 08:25 AM

Someone has gotten a mic out and measured the balls, apparently there's exactly 1 extra millimeter on the b13 balls. I think I'm gonna try it. I've got a 30 ton press at work so hopefully I can get them in with no problem, lol. I mean without breaking the arms, I know they'll go in with that press.

Adikt, any final say on the b13 ball joints to s13 rear ball joints? Still holding up? I couldnt see the pic above at work, nor would I even know if it was before or after you got your new balls.

Thanks

89dc240 · 07-08-2007, 10:25 AM

just got to see that, how nice, lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir

this is Adikt at a local event

http://s134.photobucket.com/albums/q...t=P1010143.flv

I'd say they're holding up just fine.

Adikt · 07-28-2007, 02:04 AM

The ones in my s14 were changed out in march, to this day they still work perfectly.

I've been driving it on the street alot and have been to 6 track events so far, no extra play, nothing looks out of the ordinary, no noise clanks or clunks everything checks out and runs like a dream.

The s13 ones went into my buddies hatch around the same time. We only got it running 2 weeks ago but theres no issues yet.

Once one goes out I'll let you guys know

ALSO would like to add that I nailed a curb sideways and destroyed my pass. lower control arm, the balljoint made it out fine and I reused it in the LCA I swapped in

JamesS · 08-25-2007, 10:10 AM

Thanks to this post I just installed the MOOG Part # K9820 on the rear control arms of my S14. This does work! Thanks!

richardxfeng · 09-15-2007, 05:07 PM

Sorry for bumping this old thread.

Adikt, how are the ball joints holding up on your friend's S13?

Adikt · 09-17-2007, 08:07 AM

still holding up just fine, both our cars have been drivin to the limit at almost 10 events this year and no problems

punxva · 09-17-2007, 10:46 AM

please post this in my suspension FAQ, so it won't get lost forever in the tech section. it's stickied at the top

*MELLO*SOS* · 12-15-2007, 02:33 AM

Bump old thread cause I'm adding a few pictures of the Sentra front ball joints for use on the s13 RLCA. I installed these ball joints back in March of 2007, it's now 9 months ~8k miles later, and things seem to be still be ok. Just needed the PN again and wanted to add these forgotten pictures.

Got these Sentra front ball joints from Napa, so much time has passed I forgot the price. IIRC they were more expensive than I thought they should be...

^ oem s13 rear ball joint on the right, Napa Sentra front BJ on the left.

^ oem s13 ball joint diam: ~38mm

^ sentra ball join diam: ~39mm

[FYI, the s13 RLCA ball joint hole diameter measures out to <= 38mm]

^ Sentra ball joint pressed in.

The snap ring rides higher, that was about the only difference I noticed. I can't see the snap ring really providing that much support to the ball joint, especially considering the forced fitment. Maybe someone who knows more can chime in on that subject, but I don't think it's an issue... It hasn't caused any major catastrophe for me yet, these seem to work.. Do it if you can't find/afford/wait for new OEM LCA's.

*MELLO*SOS* · 12-18-2007, 09:20 AM

I forgot how expensive these damn ball joints are... $47 each at Napa

"Napa" branded.

veilside180sx · 12-18-2007, 09:31 AM

We had been doing this years ago, because it's the only way to get a Spicer ball joint for the 240=)

*MELLO*SOS* · 12-18-2007, 12:30 PM

Never heard of that brand, are they some of the best there is or what? Do you have any part #s or other info on the subject?

Nikeboy355 · 12-18-2007, 12:49 PM

They work perfectly... I've been running these in my car for the last year and a half... Mostly track time...

Here is more info:

http://forums.freshalloy.com/showthr...=159071&page=2

sil_fourty · 12-18-2007, 04:42 PM

Not to say it doesn't work, or it isn't safe, but now that you've gone and pressed that ball joint in to your LCA, it will never accept another one again. From an engineer's stand point, you are doing a very bad thing. the retaining clip should be firmly pressed against the LCA to prevent the ball joint from moving around, and the extra mm could end up cracking the LCA and your wheel will fall off tearing some stuff up along the way.

Again, I'm no engineer, but from experience, almost right is still wrong. think about it, what happens when you try to break a 10mm bolt with an 11mm 12 point socket? it strips the bolt/socket, no? and you would never hammer a 10 mm socket on to an 11mm bolt, correct? If you asked me, that wasn't the smartest thing to do.

Given the resources, here's what I'd do:

Get the Sentra ball joint into a lathe, mill off .5mm (this will equal 1mm because you are taking material off of both sides at the same time, it's round) from the part that seats into the LCA. Now install the b.j. to the LCA, take a measurement from the top of the LCA to the bottom of the snap ring seat. Get some mild steel flat stock and mill/turn out some spacers to take up that space. You could weld them to the LCA, or just let the snap ring hold them in place, they won't go anywhere.

Another option would be to take the LCA and modify it to fit the Sentra ball joint as a direct fit, with no spacers, or machine work on the ball joint.

I know, I know, shut up, noob. But, hey, I'm just giving my opinion on the matter, and the fact that this could be considered a safety issue, I thought it would be good to give everyone some more thought food.

jim1234664 · 03-28-2008, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sil_fourty

Not to say it doesn't work, or it isn't safe, but now that you've gone and pressed that ball joint in to your LCA, it will never accept another one again. From an engineer's stand point, you are doing a very bad thing. the retaining clip should be firmly pressed against the LCA to prevent the ball joint from moving around, and the extra mm could end up cracking the LCA and your wheel will fall off tearing some stuff up along the way.

Again, I'm no engineer, but from experience, almost right is still wrong. think about it, what happens when you try to break a 10mm bolt with an 11mm 12 point socket? it strips the bolt/socket, no? and you would never hammer a 10 mm socket on to an 11mm bolt, correct? If you asked me, that wasn't the smartest thing to do.

Given the resources, here's what I'd do:

Get the Sentra ball joint into a lathe, mill off .5mm (this will equal 1mm because you are taking material off of both sides at the same time, it's round) from the part that seats into the LCA. Now install the b.j. to the LCA, take a measurement from the top of the LCA to the bottom of the snap ring seat. Get some mild steel flat stock and mill/turn out some spacers to take up that space. You could weld them to the LCA, or just let the snap ring hold them in place, they won't go anywhere.

Another option would be to take the LCA and modify it to fit the Sentra ball joint as a direct fit, with no spacers, or machine work on the ball joint.

I know, I know, shut up, noob. But, hey, I'm just giving my opinion on the matter, and the fact that this could be considered a safety issue, I thought it would be good to give everyone some more thought food.

you're missing the fact that the nut on the top of the ball joint draws it up and holds it in the LCA as well as connects it to the upright. its
not going anywhere

and by the way, how would you chuck up a ball joint in a lathe?? dont think its possible and even if you could the chuck would be way to close to the bottom shank

naed240sx · 03-28-2008, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MELLO*SOS

39mm sentra balljoint in 38mm hole post

How the hell did you manage to get that thing pressed in? 1mm difference is HUGE for tolerance fit parts. I'm amazed you didn't crack the LCA in the process. I had enough trouble just pressing in some new s14 balljoints into my s13 LCA's.

D1GP · 03-28-2008, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by naed240sx

How the hell did you manage to get that thing pressed in? 1mm difference is HUGE for tolerance fit parts. I'm amazed you didn't crack the LCA in the process. I had enough trouble just pressing in some new s14 balljoints into my s13 LCA's.

goes in pretty damn smooth if you freeze the balljoint and use a C-clamp press thing.

*MELLO*SOS* · 04-14-2008, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by naed240sx

How the hell did you manage to get that thing pressed in? 1mm difference is HUGE for tolerance fit parts. I'm amazed you didn't crack the LCA in the process. I had enough trouble just pressing in some new s14 balljoints into my s13 LCA's.

Just used the C-CLAMP press tool. I checked the LCA afterwards and there are no visible cracks. Done this twice now with no issues, seems to be the only option for the rear aside from new lca's...

jim1234664 · 04-14-2008, 11:32 AM

I propane torched my control arms first and it went in with less force than it took the oem ones to come out

Flybert · 04-14-2008, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sil_fourty

Not to say it doesn't work, or it isn't safe, but now that you've gone and pressed that ball joint in to your LCA, it will never accept another one again. From an engineer's stand point, you are doing a very bad thing. the retaining clip should be firmly pressed against the LCA to prevent the ball joint from moving around, and the extra mm could end up cracking the LCA and your wheel will fall off tearing some stuff up along the way.

Again, I'm no engineer...

Where I stopped listening to this guy.

03-04-2007, 02:58 PM	#1
Adikt Zilvia Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Chicago Age: 37 Posts: 278 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	S13 & S14 Rear Ball Joints Answered S13 & S14 Rear Ball Joints Nissan doesn't sell the ball joint separate from the rear lower control arm. Upon doing some digging the following will work in the rear S13 = B13 SE-R front, we used MOOG Part # K9449 S14 = Same as S14 front, I used MOOG Part # K9820

07-28-2007, 02:04 AM	#14
Adikt Zilvia Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Chicago Age: 37 Posts: 278 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	The ones in my s14 were changed out in march, to this day they still work perfectly. I've been driving it on the street alot and have been to 6 track events so far, no extra play, nothing looks out of the ordinary, no noise clanks or clunks everything checks out and runs like a dream. The s13 ones went into my buddies hatch around the same time. We only got it running 2 weeks ago but theres no issues yet. Once one goes out I'll let you guys know ALSO would like to add that I nailed a curb sideways and destroyed my pass. lower control arm, the balljoint made it out fine and I reused it in the LCA I swapped in Last edited by Adikt; 07-28-2007 at 02:06 AM.. Reason: more info

09-17-2007, 08:07 AM	#17
Adikt Zilvia Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Chicago Age: 37 Posts: 278 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	still holding up just fine, both our cars have been drivin to the limit at almost 10 events this year and no problems __________________ "yo wheels are so sunk im gonna need an extension" "havin 1000 horses is like tryin to catch dinner with a rocket launcher"

12-15-2007, 02:33 AM	#19
MELLOSOS* LAID OUT Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: LAS VEGAS Age: 42 Posts: 2,015 Trader Rating: (1) Rides Gallery: MELLO*SOS Feedback Score: 1 reviews	Bump old thread cause I'm adding a few pictures of the Sentra front ball joints for use on the s13 RLCA. I installed these ball joints back in March of 2007, it's now 9 months ~8k miles later, and things seem to be still be ok. Just needed the PN again and wanted to add these forgotten pictures. Got these Sentra front ball joints from Napa, so much time has passed I forgot the price. IIRC they were more expensive than I thought they should be... ^ oem s13 rear ball joint on the right, Napa Sentra front BJ on the left. ^ oem s13 rear ball joint on the right, Napa Sentra front BJ on the left. ^ oem s13 ball joint diam: ~38mm ^ sentra ball join diam: ~39mm [FYI, the s13 RLCA ball joint hole diameter measures out to <= 38mm] ^ Sentra ball joint pressed in. The snap ring rides higher, that was about the only difference I noticed. I can't see the snap ring really providing that much support to the ball joint, especially considering the forced fitment. Maybe someone who knows more can chime in on that subject, but I don't think it's an issue... It hasn't caused any major catastrophe for me yet, these seem to work.. Do it if you can't find/afford/wait for new OEM LCA's.

12-18-2007, 09:31 AM	#21
veilside180sx Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 303 Trader Rating: (0) Rides Gallery: veilside180sx Feedback Score: 0 reviews	We had been doing this years ago, because it's the only way to get a Spicer ball joint for the 240=) __________________ www.nissanroadracing.com

03-04-2007, 05:50 PM	#2
projectRDM Post Whore! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Atlanta Age: 50 Posts: 13,812 Trader Rating: (12) Feedback Score: 12 reviews	And you're certain these have the correct taper? If so that's great, but you'd also think they'd cross it over if it did indeed fit both models.

03-17-2007, 06:13 PM	#3
MELLOSOS* LAID OUT Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: LAS VEGAS Age: 42 Posts: 2,015 Trader Rating: (1) Rides Gallery: MELLO*SOS Feedback Score: 1 reviews	According to the NAPA website, they have B13 upper and lower ball joints, is there any difference? Both show the same non-Napa PN, K9449 http://www.napaautoparts.com/MasterP...MPartNum=K9449

03-17-2007, 07:56 PM	#5
Munch Zilvia Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Fresno, CA Age: 37 Posts: 165 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	So is this definite? I dont wanna havta go out and buy some ball joins i think will work in my rear and end up braking something cause they fell off or whatever. Sounds awesome though.

04-11-2007, 12:21 PM	#6
Zenki_Toronto Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Toronto Posts: 3 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Hi, It seems like a lot of ppl are running into this problem! (ALL 240 owners apparently) Has anyone figured out if the "S14 front lower ball joint = S14 rear lower ball joint" question? I've checked this thread about this person claiming he has done it without measuring it and it worked out perfectly fine. However, he's banned so I cant contact him to see how it's holding up until now and really, one guy's story can't be taken seriously unless it is confirmed by numerous other sources... http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.p...ear+ball+joint Thanks. Nima

04-11-2007, 12:43 PM	#7
projectRDM Post Whore! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Atlanta Age: 50 Posts: 13,812 Trader Rating: (12) Feedback Score: 12 reviews	They do not interchange fron to rear, this is fact. As for other models crossing over, I'd seriously think a manafacturer would detail that. Odds are that there still is not a direct fit, OE replacement for the rear Aarm for either S13 or S14, but people are getting away with 'close' and not breaking anything yet.

04-11-2007, 03:45 PM	#8
jackal264 Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: vancouver, canada Age: 38 Posts: 360 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	i'm in the middle of this problem to. are you 100% sure the s14 rears are diff then the s14 fronts? i went out and bought a moog #k9820 and it looks identical but i'm not gonna put it in unless its safe.

07-06-2007, 02:22 PM	#9
89dc240 Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Just South of Philly Age: 40 Posts: 352 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Adikt,,, You have personally used the b13 ball joint in the rear of an S13? How'd it go, still working in there?

07-06-2007, 07:34 PM	#10
turtl631 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Milwaukee WI Posts: 900 Trader Rating: (3) Feedback Score: 3 reviews	Honestly, someone who has tried this or has some ball joints needs to whip out a caliper and start taking measurements. Its not something you want to eyeball and take a chance on, but if there's a good alternative to new arms, this will save people a lot of money.

07-07-2007, 08:25 AM	#12
89dc240 Zilvia Junkie Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Just South of Philly Age: 40 Posts: 352 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Someone has gotten a mic out and measured the balls, apparently there's exactly 1 extra millimeter on the b13 balls. I think I'm gonna try it. I've got a 30 ton press at work so hopefully I can get them in with no problem, lol. I mean without breaking the arms, I know they'll go in with that press. Adikt, any final say on the b13 ball joints to s13 rear ball joints? Still holding up? I couldnt see the pic above at work, nor would I even know if it was before or after you got your new balls. Thanks

08-25-2007, 10:10 AM	#15
JamesS Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Ontario, CAN Age: 43 Posts: 9 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	Thanks to this post I just installed the MOOG Part # K9820 on the rear control arms of my S14. This does work! Thanks!

09-15-2007, 05:07 PM	#16
richardxfeng Zilvia Addict Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: China Posts: 675 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Sorry for bumping this old thread. Adikt, how are the ball joints holding up on your friend's S13?

12-18-2007, 09:20 AM	#20
MELLOSOS* LAID OUT Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: LAS VEGAS Age: 42 Posts: 2,015 Trader Rating: (1) Rides Gallery: MELLO*SOS Feedback Score: 1 reviews	I forgot how expensive these damn ball joints are... $47 each at Napa "Napa" branded.

12-18-2007, 12:30 PM	#22
MELLOSOS* LAID OUT Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: LAS VEGAS Age: 42 Posts: 2,015 Trader Rating: (1) Rides Gallery: MELLO*SOS Feedback Score: 1 reviews	Never heard of that brand, are they some of the best there is or what? Do you have any part #s or other info on the subject?

12-18-2007, 12:49 PM	#23
Nikeboy355 Zilvia Addict Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Los Angeles, CA Age: 44 Posts: 734 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	They work perfectly... I've been running these in my car for the last year and a half... Mostly track time... Here is more info: http://forums.freshalloy.com/showthr...=159071&page=2 __________________ http://respectvolkracing.blogspot.com/

12-18-2007, 04:42 PM	#24
sil_fourty Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Central Oklahoma Posts: 25 Trader Rating: (0) Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Not to say it doesn't work, or it isn't safe, but now that you've gone and pressed that ball joint in to your LCA, it will never accept another one again. From an engineer's stand point, you are doing a very bad thing. the retaining clip should be firmly pressed against the LCA to prevent the ball joint from moving around, and the extra mm could end up cracking the LCA and your wheel will fall off tearing some stuff up along the way. Again, I'm no engineer, but from experience, almost right is still wrong. think about it, what happens when you try to break a 10mm bolt with an 11mm 12 point socket? it strips the bolt/socket, no? and you would never hammer a 10 mm socket on to an 11mm bolt, correct? If you asked me, that wasn't the smartest thing to do. Given the resources, here's what I'd do: Get the Sentra ball joint into a lathe, mill off .5mm (this will equal 1mm because you are taking material off of both sides at the same time, it's round) from the part that seats into the LCA. Now install the b.j. to the LCA, take a measurement from the top of the LCA to the bottom of the snap ring seat. Get some mild steel flat stock and mill/turn out some spacers to take up that space. You could weld them to the LCA, or just let the snap ring hold them in place, they won't go anywhere. Another option would be to take the LCA and modify it to fit the Sentra ball joint as a direct fit, with no spacers, or machine work on the ball joint. I know, I know, shut up, noob. But, hey, I'm just giving my opinion on the matter, and the fact that this could be considered a safety issue, I thought it would be good to give everyone some more thought food.

04-14-2008, 11:32 AM	#29
jim1234664 Zilvia Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Buffalo, NY Posts: 227 Trader Rating: (1) Feedback Score: 1 reviews	I propane torched my control arms first and it went in with less force than it took the oem ones to come out